4:13 Podcast: Can I Recognize Jesus in My Everyday Life? With Kyle Idleman

Kyle Idleman: We tend to kind of approach Jesus and approach faith as a drawer in the dresser of our lives. And we're fine if somebody rummages around in our -- like, you come to church and they rummage around in your faith drawer, that's fine. But we have these other drawers like money and relationships, and we have these other drawers like politics, and we don't want faith to be involved in those areas of our life. We get uncomfortable, that starts to feel intrusive.

But the Gospel understanding of following Jesus is that he is the dresser that all the drawers fit into, that he has domain over all these different areas. And so the more we recognize him as Messiah, the more we're declaring his lordship over every area of our life.

Jennifer Rothschild: What if your Jesus is shaped more by culture than by Scripture? Like, if Jesus walked in the room right now, would you recognize him? Ooh.

Well, on today's 4:13, pastor and best-selling author Kyle Idleman is going to help you know who Jesus really is, discover what's missing in our relationship with him, and cut through this cultural chaos to live the life that Jesus promised. I'm telling you, this is gonna be super good. We're gonna trace Jesus through Scripture and see that he might just be the missing Messiah.

All right. This is gonna be life-changing, so what are we waiting for?

KC Wright: Let's go. Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you up to live the "I Can" life, because you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, welcome your host, my soul sister, Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: Hey guys. Jennifer here to help you be and do more than you feel capable of as you're living this "I Can" life of Philippians 4:13 along with me and KC. KC's my Seeing Eye Guy. When I'm out on the road, sometimes people think KC's my husband. I'm like, "No. I got a stud husband."

KC Wright: That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: Stud husband is named Dr. Phil. KC is my Seeing Eye Guy. And I'm so thankful we get to do this podcast together, 'cause it's just two friends, one topic, and zero stress.

KC and I were talking before we got on mic. I was asking you about your weekend. You started to tell and I realized, ooh, this is not a zero stress answer. But I want you to go ahead, 'cause I stopped you. Let's hear about your weekend.

KC Wright: Okay. First, we know that spiritually we are the victorious ones.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

KC Wright: Spiritually -- spiritually we win this thing. Okay?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

KC Wright: But sometimes life is hard, God is good.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay.

KC Wright: Pam Thum wrote a song about that.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, she did, years ago.

KC Wright: So let me just tell you what happened in one weekend.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right. What happened in one weekend?

KC Wright: Well, where I'm living, where I'm living, we had some naders come through, some tornadoes. It was tornado season.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, that's right.

KC Wright: Now, this was on the eve of me being the host of a huge pastors' summit.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh.

KC Wright: So pastors were coming in, and I was hosting, and it was the very next morning. But because of tornado sirens -- which by the way, I have one right by my house. I have a siren by my house. Okay? And so your phones go off, the siren goes off, you know.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, that's chaos.

KC Wright: And listen, I know that my neighbors, they know I'm a Christian. They know I'm a Christian. But it's not until nader season that they remember, oh, he's a Pentecostal.

Jennifer Rothschild: Let's get him to pray.

KC Wright: Because let me tell you, when those sirens go off, I'm in the front yard. I'm rebuking. I'm binding.

Jennifer Rothschild: You go, Pastor KC.

KC Wright: I'm asking for angels to protect the neighborhood. And listen, you can think what you want about that. But several years ago a street behind me was wiped out, you know, flattened, and the bikes and trash can in my yard didn't even move.

Jennifer Rothschild: Wow.

KC Wright: So this guy's praying, right?

Jennifer Rothschild: Right.

KC Wright: So I wobble in, limp in to the pastors' conference the following morning on about one hour of sleep.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, I bet.

KC Wright: It's Jesus and caffeine getting me through.

Jennifer Rothschild: Right, right.

KC Wright: Okay?

Jennifer Rothschild: Which is a good combo, let's be honest.

KC Wright: Well, so after a rough night of no sleep, the pastors' conference was a huge success. I loved hosting. What an honor. And I catered a sandwich -- I catered a sandwich box for each pastor. I'm not going to mention the sandwich.

Jennifer Rothschild: Don't say the -- right, the store.

KC Wright: I will not, because I don't want the 4:13 suit.

Jennifer Rothschild: No, no, no. Okay, because of what's coming next.

KC Wright: I'm not gonna mention --

Jennifer Rothschild: That's a good tease. Dada da dum. What happened?

KC Wright: So I had me a sandwich with the pastors. There were sandwiches left, and I -- I had an extra box and I had it for dinner as well. And they were tasty. But about 4 AM, early Sunday morning, food poisoning.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, KC.

KC Wright: The worst experience I've ever --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes. I've had it once. It's horrible.

KC Wright: It was horrible.

Jennifer Rothschild: There's nothing like it. You don't question what it is because it's so bad.

KC Wright: And I am thankful that in my life I have people that know God better than I do. I have evangelists and pastors in my life. I have a pastor, I have evangelist friends. I have spiritual saints in my life. I am texting them, I am -- "Pray for me."

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, bless you.

KC Wright: I mean, it is -- it was terrible. It lasted three days.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh.

KC Wright: So ham and Satan invoke the same feeling for me, and Jesus and Motrin now invoke the same feeling for me.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, that's hilarious.

KC Wright: Because the only thing to relieve this pain was Motrin. I popped Motrin and the pain left.

Jennifer Rothschild: Well, you know what? You just got a little feel of what it's like to be in labor.

KC Wright: Oh, it was terrible.

Jennifer Rothschild: The cramping is terrible.

KC Wright: It was terrible. You know, you're laying there at 3:00 AM with the phone in the hand, you think -- you're like, I'm going to have to dial 911. I cannot move forward with this pain anymore, right? But praise God, praise God, you know, I'm on the other side of it.

Jennifer Rothschild: Gosh.

KC Wright: I'm on the other side it. My daughter and I went out after church Sunday to one of our favorite places to eat. And I got this breakfast bowl and I said, "Is there any ham in here? Is there any ham in here?"

Jennifer Rothschild: I'm anti-ham.

KC Wright: And I was like very -- you know -- you know --

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh gosh. Now, did she get sick?

KC Wright: No.

Jennifer Rothschild: Thank you, Lord.

KC Wright: It took four other people down in --

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. And you did have two sandwiches, so you doubled up.

KC Wright: Chubby boy really got it. The other people got a slight touch of food poisoning, but chubby boy, who had two sandwiches...

But, yes, I just wanted to share, yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of ham, I will fear no evil. Anyway, these lips are never touching bacon, ham --

Jennifer Rothschild: Not even bacon?

KC Wright: No. I've been delivered.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. Because bacon has enough nitrates, dude, you -- that could survive a nuclear war and not make you sick.

KC Wright: But, you know, sometimes we just have rough weekends.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, we do.

KC Wright: But guess -- or, you know, rough days. But God is good. Jesus is the healer.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, he is.

KC Wright: My precious daughter, she kept saying, "I don't know how to help you --

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, that's sweet.

KC Wright: -- and I want to."

Jennifer Rothschild: She's so darling.

KC Wright: And I said, "Come lay hands on your father and pray."

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

KC Wright: She would come lay hands on me and pray.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's so precious.

KC Wright: But anyway, thanks for listening. It was horrible.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, gosh. Okay. And all the sisters said amen. We've been there. Those of you that have had food poisoning, if you've been through labor, I'm just saying it's very close, because I've done both. The only problem with food poisoning is, you know, you've got a lot coming out all the places. Anyway, enough.

Wow, how do you even transition?

KC Wright: You don't.

Jennifer Rothschild: I think I'm leaving that up to you. You get to introduce Kyle now.

KC Wright: Kyle Idleman is a best-selling author and the senior pastor at Southeast Christian Church in Louisville, Kentucky, one of the largest churches in America. Kyle is the author of "Not a Fan," one of my favorite books --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

KC Wright: -- "One At A Time," "The End of Me," "God's At War," "Grace Is Greater," and "Don't Give Up." Kyle's favorite thing to do is hang out with the love of his life, DesiRae. They have four beautiful children: Mackenzie, Morgan, Macy, and Kael.

He's one of my favorite pastors. I love this man.

Jennifer Rothschild: Me too.

KC Wright: And settle in for a wonderful chat. There's room at the table for you. Here's Jennifer and Kyle.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right, Kyle, this book we're going to talk about today is called "The Missing Messiah." So before we even get to the missing part, let's tackle the Messiah part. So let's talk about Jesus as our Messiah. Who is Jesus according to Scripture?

Kyle Idleman: Yeah. So the word Messiah is a word that a lot of us probably connect maybe with Christmas. We don't necessarily connect the word Messiah with Christ.

I think if you ask a lot of even Christians, like, Hey, when we say Jesus Christ, what do we mean? They might think, oh, well, you know, Christ is, like, Jesus' last name. That tends to be how we, you know, talk about Jesus Christ as, you know, first and last.

And really Christ is the New Testament word for Messiah, and it's a declaration of his Kingdom authority. So when we say Jesus Christ, we're saying Jesus the Messiah, the promised King that came to establish his reign. It separates a bit, not in a mutually exclusive way, but it separates a little the idea of Jesus as Savior from Jesus as King. I want to be careful there. Those two things are not separate, but they each have their own implications, their own understanding.

So Jesus as Savior, we celebrate who gets us into heaven, we recognize that he's the way, the truth, the life, that there's no way to the Father except through him. That he made a way when there was no way, that he did for us what we could never do for ourselves, Jesus as Savior.

But Jesus as King is a statement of allegiance. It is an understanding that believing in Jesus means following him now, that there are implications to that statement and how we live our lives today. So, you know, for the average believer, kind of marrying those two understandings of Jesus as Savior, Jesus as Messiah, or Jesus as King is what we've really tried to reintroduce to people through this book.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, I love that. Because as I'm listening to this, I'm thinking I'm not sure that that's how we relate to Jesus. When I just think of my, you know, average -- if I'm just not really thinking, do I really relate to Jesus that way? Do I think of him that way? And then I look at the church at large and I think I'm not sure about that.

So I'd be curious, in your opinion what are some signs that our view of Jesus may not be quite as accurate, or that maybe it's even drifted a little bit from Scripture?

Kyle Idleman: I use this metaphor analogy in the book about when my daughter was young, taking her to Build-A-Bear. Are you familiar with the Build-A-Bear stores, Jennifer?

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, yes. We've done that too. Where you think you're going to spend $30 and you leave spending $130, right?

Kyle Idleman: Yes, exactly. Yeah.

And what is so appealing about, you know, the Build-A-Bear business approach and the story is that it's all very customized. You can decide, you know, do I want this bear to be, you know, more firm or do I want it to be more squishy? What do I want it to say to me? What do I want it to not say to me? You know, you basically get to choose what goes in there.

And culturally, that is our approach to most things, that it's -- you know, it's customized, it's the way we want it, it's personalized. And so sometimes we talk about Jesus being a personal Savior, which is good language, but what we're really describing is Jesus as a personalized Savior, which is dangerous, where, you know, he fits into the box that I want him to fit into.

And so one of the things we do in the book is just kind of unpack that. That culturally, you know, we're very uncomfortable with, for example, like a convenient Jesus that, you know, fits into our Sunday mornings, that kind of stays in his own drawer but doesn't really get involved with maybe our finances or our certain relationships, our entertainment choices. So kind of this convenient Jesus. Or maybe another word for that would be compartmentalized Jesus.

We really like a therapeutic Jesus. And listen, Jesus, you know, he cares a lot about our peace and about joy and -- you know, so there's a sense in which that's -- you know, it's not that that approach is all wrong. Jesus cares about our emotional wounds and he wants us to live with the Philippians 4:13 type of contentment and confidence that you talk about.

Jennifer Rothschild: Sure, sure.

Kyle Idleman: But his primary concern is not, you know, making sure we feel good about ourselves. And, you know -- and the beauty and irony of the Gospel is that in sacrificing, in laying down our lives, we find true life. We find that John 10:10, you know, life to the full.

And I give one more example here, is like the partisan Jesus where -- you know, that Jesus kind of conveniently agrees with our political platform or -- you know, whatever's happening culturally, you know, he's kind of on the side of what do the most people think.

And so kind of recognizing we put Jesus into these ways of customizing him -- that I don't think is necessarily nefarious. I don't think we're doing it with this ulterior motive. But from the very beginning, people have tried to do that with Jesus.

Jennifer Rothschild: Well, sure. And it's not thorough. And so if we don't approach Christ in his wholeness, then we don't experience the whole message of the Gospel and who he is.

Kyle Idleman: Yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: And so as I'm hearing this, I also think, okay, so what if -- like, what if we can rediscover the true meaning of who Messiah is as King in our lives? How would that reshape our understanding of Jesus and, therefore, how we live?

Kyle Idleman: To me, this kind of drives to the word in the Gospels of following Jesus. Sometimes -- again, I don't think this is done intentionally, but we'll separate the idea of believing and following and, you know, we'll say, well, I believe in Jesus, when in the New Testament, and certainly in the first-century culture there, you know, believing and following were words that went together.

That in the same way that you wouldn't declare on your wedding day this commitment and then not change anything in your life, that this recognition that Jesus is my Savior, that I'm believing in him and I'm putting my faith in him, that calls us to following. It calls us to a different filter that we live our lives through, of decisions we make, of sacrifices we make, of how we handle our finances.

Like it -- Jesus as Messiah has a way of affecting everything, and it's this acknowledgement that every area of my life belongs to him.

A metaphor that I referenced earlier, that I unpack in the book, is, you know, that we tend to kind of approach Jesus and approach faith as a drawer in the dresser of our lives. And we're fine if somebody rummages around in our -- like, you come to church and they rummage around in your faith drawer, that's fine.

But we have these other drawers like money and relationships, and we have these other drawers like politics, and we don't want faith to be involved in those areas of our life. We get uncomfortable. That starts to feel intrusive.

But the Gospel understanding of following Jesus is that he is the dresser that all the drawers fit into, that he has domain over all these different areas. And so the more we recognize him as Messiah, the more we're declaring his lordship over every area of our life.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. So -- I love that, and I agree 100%.

So as I'm thinking about this customized Jesus that we have, and then you just give this antidote for it, which -- okay, so if you realize you've customized your Jesus, then you're going to follow the true Messiah. Okay. So what else can we do to correct that?

So here's what I'm thinking, Kyle. Okay. So if I have a misunderstanding of who Messiah is and what his rulership and kingship means in my life, I'm -- until I figure out what the true biblical Jesus is, I'm still gonna follow the customized Jesus. So how do we get this real true understanding of who Christ is as King?

Kyle Idleman: You know, I think in the Gospels the narratives help us unpack it a little. Let me explain what I mean by that. If you look at Jesus when he calls his disciples, the emphasis is not on their worthiness. In other words, he's not asking for applications to prove that they've earned it and they deserve to be considered his followers. Instead, they're based on an invitation, and yet the invitation has certain implications.

So when Jesus calls Matthew as a tax collector, you know, he left his tax collection booth behind so that he could follow Jesus. So that's what it looks like. On the opposite of that, when the rich young ruler comes to Jesus and says, "Well, I want to follow you," you know, Jesus recognizes that there is this idol in his life of money and possessions, and Jesus says, "Hey, if you want to follow me, then here's what I'm going to ask you to do." It's the only time he asks something like that, but he knew what was on the throne of this man's heart and so he calls him to do that.

So what I would challenge people with is does your narrative, does your personal story include moments where Jesus calls you to sacrifice, where he calls you, you know, to follow in a more committed way? Are there things you can point to as a cost to following Jesus? Jesus said in Luke 9:23, "If you want to come after me, you must deny yourself, take up your cross daily and follow me." So that's the invitation.

And then in the Gospels, we see stories of how that plays out, which I think really challenges our story. Okay, this is what it looks like. It's not just agreeing with certain teachings, but it's recognizing alignment, that those teachings, you know, have very practical application in how we -- how our stories are told.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, that's good. All right. So there is always an invitation from Christ which will be -- there will be implications, then, in our lives because of it. All right, that's super helpful.

And so you mentioned a little earlier about the therapeutic Jesus. So how could somebody tell -- okay, let me -- before I ask this, let me preface it by this. There is nothing wrong, I know you would agree, with us receiving very practical application from the Word when we experience teaching. But sometimes we, you know, just kind of stop there. And so my question would be, how can someone tell if they are relating to Jesus just as their personal life coach rather than King?

Kyle Idleman: That's a great question. So I think to be really clear here, you know, Jesus wants to— he wants you to have peace in your life. He wants you -- he cares about, you know, your emotion and your feeling. So when we talk about this, I don't want anyone to misunderstand that -- understand the message that Jesus doesn't care. You know, the number one emotion that Jesus felt in the Gospels was compassion, which is the only emotion that is not based upon what's happening to me, it's based on what's happening to someone else.

So Jesus is very compassionate. You know, we just read that again and again, that Jesus saw and he had compassion. So I want, you know, people who are listening to this to understand the heart of Jesus is compassion.

So when we talk about, you know, Jesus as this therapeutic Savior, you know, the idea or the warning, the caution, is that he doesn't exist primarily to heal your emotional wounds and boost your self-esteem. And so the way to watch out for this, or kind of the red flag in this, is, you know, do you find that Jesus is always affirming, but never confronting? Like, he just always agrees with what you want to do, or does he challenge your wants?

And do you understand his primary concern in your life to be happiness or to be holiness? In other words, I think for some, a therapeutic Jesus is revealed when their mindset is, well, he -- Jesus is fine with this because he wants me to be happy. And it's not that Jesus doesn't care about your joy and about your happiness. It's just not his primary focus. It's not the primary purpose of your life.

And so do I think of him as being mostly concerned with me being happy, that I can pretty much justify what I want to do as a follower of Jesus as long as it makes me happy, then that would be, you know, a red flag for the therapeutic Jesus.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right. Yeah, those are super really good red flags.

You know, I remember my kids when they were little, I would tell them selfish people aren't happy people. And so it's this kind of concept when you think of Christ, when we're in it transactionally to get everything we want from him, we never will experience what we're really longing for, which is --

Kyle Idleman: Yeah, that's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: -- that deep relationship with the wholeness of who he is. And yet when there is sacrifice, when there is obedience, when there's all those beautiful things that God calls us to in Christ, then we experience what we're really looking for: the peace, the happiness. It's almost -- it's just an interesting paradigm to think about.

All right, two more questions.

Kyle Idleman: I really want -- can I just jump on word?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, please. Please do.

Kyle Idleman: You used a word -- you used a word that I think is so helpful, you know, that it's this transaction idea. That when we have a transactional faith -- it's kind of like this equation, oh, yeah, believe in Jesus, improve yourself, equals get to heaven.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

Kyle Idleman: So heaven becomes this product, and belief is the admission, and Jesus is the -- you know, he's the ticket agent.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

Kyle Idleman: And it doesn't -- it doesn't make really -- it, you know, makes very minimal demands while promising maximum reward. And so if you compare kind of the transactional faith to true discipleship, it doesn't -- it celebrates that Jesus is our way to heaven, but it also recognizes that I am joining in on this Kingdom invitation. You know, Jesus didn't just say believe in these doctrinal points, you know, he said, "Imitate my entire life."

And so that contrast of, okay, I don't -- I want to celebrate believing in Jesus and experiencing his free gift of salvation, according to Romans, but I don't want to see my relationship with him as a transactional relationship where, you know, I -- if I do this, then it's his job to do this. And, you know, I -- because I prayed this prayer, or because I raised my hand, I've taken care of that. Like, that does not capture the kind of relationship that Jesus invites us into.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. And it doesn't capture or represent the kindness of Christ and his sacrifice toward us.

Kyle Idleman: That's so good. That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: And it messes up with our sense of identity, because then there's no identity. You're just a consumer. You're not a child, you're not a joint heir, you're not a brother and sister, you're just a -- yeah, a consumer. So when I said that about joint heirs and brothers and sisters, it's this sense of Kingdom, that if Jesus is King, and he is our Savior, and we are following him, then we're in the Kingdom.

All right. So give us briefly, what does it mean, then, as followers to represent him, as you mentioned -- for our whole lives to look like his as the Kingdom here on earth?

Kyle Idleman: You know, I guess I would mention a few, you know, practical things.

One is to pray, "Your Kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven." My, you know, experience would say just praying that prayer regularly gives me eyes to see some things differently. So I don't want that to be just this pleasant liturgical language that, you know, gets put on repeat, but rather we are articulating in that prayer, hey, this is his heartbeat for his mission. And so to pray that prayer.

And then, you know, I would challenge people to make one or two practical shifts. Let me give you an example. Where you would say, okay, what would it look like for his Kingdom to come in my work? That I'm not going to just understand that my job is how I make a living, but it's how I represent the King. The question isn't is Jesus proud of my career, you know, the question is am I serving his Kingdom through my work? And so if you'll just maybe practice looking at your work and asking that question, what's it look like for your Kingdom to come in my work?

I'll give you one other example. Like, what would it look like for his Kingdom to come in my finances? We recognize Kingdom economics look different than our, you know, Western world economics. And how is that true? And if you'll pray the prayer, "Your Kingdom come," and then you'll pick an area, you'll pick a drawer, if you will, to rummage around in, it begins to shape how you approach that and then it begins to ripple out into other areas of your life.

So that would be one of my encouragements, is to pray the prayer and then pick one or two areas where you can specifically begin to ask the question what's it look like to live with Jesus as Messiah, to represent the King, to bring God's Kingdom into this part of my life?

Jennifer Rothschild: Good stuff, Pastor Kyle. And, I mean, Jesus -- that was his model prayer. That's what was on Jesus' heart when the disciples said, "How do I pray?" He said, well, this is what you include. So if Jesus tells his disciples -- and we are his disciples -- this is how you pray, then this is how we pray. Yes, Lord, your Kingdom come. Good stuff.

All right, Brother, we're going to get to our last question. I'm so grateful that we are focusing on him. He is our King. He is.

Kyle Idleman: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right, last question. There's someone listening, and perhaps it's because they've customized Jesus, perhaps it's because they have a more transactional relationship, or perhaps it's just because, you know, they just don't get it yet, but they know they've had an experience of salvation with Christ. They believe in Jesus and they believe Jesus has saved them, but they still feel right now like Jesus is just distant, far away. How could you encourage them as this podcast ends?

Kyle Idleman: That is a great question. I think the reason -- and I want to be careful here because it's not the only reason. But I think a primary reason Jesus often feels distant in the life of a believer isn't because he's moved, but it's because -- if I could say it this way -- the version of him that we have been relating to was never real enough to sustain what he invites us into.

Like, that we -- you know, I talk to people who have -- they feel disillusioned by the church or disillusioned in their faith. And my question is, is it possible that you've put Jesus in a box and that's who you're rightly, you know, deconstructing? Like, that's not him. So, you know, really be sure that the Jesus that you're putting your hope in is not a cultural interpretation of who Jesus is, but is really who he announced himself to be. It's really who we see in the Gospels.

One way to do it -- if I could just make that practical -- is don't read Scripture alone. My experience as a pastor on this is -- I see this growing trend, which I'm really excited about, that more people are reading the Bible. That is awesome. Keep doing that. But my challenge is that the Bible is not meant to be read just in isolation, that it's meant to be read in community.

And there's something that happens when you're reading Scripture with two or three other people, you read it together, and you're not just asking what does this mean for me, you're asking what does this mean for us? And other people who are following Jesus alongside of you can help show you -- with questions and with, you know, suggestions, they can help show you some ways that maybe how you've thought of Jesus isn't really the way Jesus is presented in the Gospel.

So let Scripture be your foundation in every way as you look to who Jesus is, but invite some people or invite yourself into some relationships with people where you can have that opportunity to study his life together.

Jennifer Rothschild: So, so good. Oh, my sisters and brothers, it bears repeating, do not read Scripture alone. Not in isolation. Read it in community. Ask, what does this mean for us, not just what does this mean for me.

KC Wright: We always end up with the foundation, don't we?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, we do.

KC Wright: Kyle said let the Bible be the foundation of our relationship with Jesus.

Well, there's so much good stuff here. You need Kyle's book. And we will have a link on the Show Notes right now for you, 413podcast.com/402. And, of course, the transcript will be there as well.

And I have an idea for you today. Would you mind taking a moment to share this podcast. We want others to know Jesus as King. And when you've done that, if you wouldn't mind, give a great review for this podcast on whatever platform you're listening to. It means so much. We need your reviews. They help The 4:13 grow and reach one more heart for Jesus.

All right, you know the drill.

Jennifer Rothschild: You know it.

KC Wright: Until next week, you can truly recognize Jesus in your life because you can do all things through Christ who gives you supernatural strength. I can.

Jennifer Rothschild: I can.

Jennifer and KC: And you can.