4:13 Podcast: Can I Overcome Sadness? [Episode 305]

K.C. Wright: It's been Summer Sizzle around here, so that means we've enjoyed four glorious weeks of your hottest episodes on The 4:13. For the last few weeks, we have featured your most shared episodes. By the way, thank you and feel the podcast hug. They all happen to have been great teachings from our girl, Jennifer, and we're not surprised.

So today's episode is going to be no exception, because today's 4:13 question is, Can I Overcome Sadness? This is, hands down, one of the most practical, kind, biblical, and shareable podcasts you will ever hear. At the end, our girl Jennifer, yeah, she's going to sing over you. So let the encouragement begin.

Jennifer Rothschild: Hey, I am so glad you're here. I'm Jennifer, and today I'm going to give use six strategies to overcome sadness. We all find ourselves down in the dumps sometimes, don't we? And we need to know how to get up and get out and overcome the sadness. Don't worry. This is going to be very practical and very upbeat, so get ready to take some notes. Or, if you're on the move, don't worry about it. Everything you need will be listed on the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/40.

Okay, Overcomer, here we go.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you up to live the "I Can" life, because you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, welcome your host -- she's 5'2, but much taller on the inside -- Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: That is true in spirit, K.C. But I'm just saying, I'm shrinking by the minute, and it's not right. Hey, we are so glad you're here with us. Welcome. It's always better when you show up.

It's funny that you said that, K.C., about being tall on the inside, because, truly, I am noticing aging in ways I haven't before. So last week I was putting on mascara, and I thought, Is my mascara running out or is this a different brand? And it was all, you know, good and same, new. And my lashes, they're just getting so thin, and I'm like, Where in the world have my lashes gone? And then, of course, I'm putting makeup on my face and I feel my chin. I'm like, Oh, there they are. It's just not right.

K.C. Wright: Oh, my goodness.

Jennifer Rothschild: It's not right.

K.C. Wright: I was on Facebook and I came across some people that I graduated high school from -- with, I graduated high school with. And I'm not being unkind, but I went -- my first thought was, Oh, they look so old. And then I immediately ran to the mirror and I was thinking, Do I look that old? No, I don't look that old. But it's weird, because time is going by at warped speed --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: -- and I am in this mind frame of it's not affecting me. But maybe it is.

Jennifer Rothschild: Brother --

K.C. Wright: I just don't think I'm as old as they look, but maybe I am, I don't know. But you know what? Here's --

Jennifer Rothschild: I wonder if that's what they think when they see your Facebook page --

K.C. Wright: Here's the truth --

Jennifer Rothschild: -- oh, he's so old.

K.C. Wright: We're aging together.

Jennifer Rothschild: We are.

K.C. Wright: We are.

Jennifer Rothschild: We're in this thing together.

K.C. Wright: And should the Lord tarry, we'll continue aging.

Jennifer Rothschild: And it is better than the alternative, that's right.

K.C. Wright: That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: We should be grateful.

K.C. Wright: And the sunset is just as beautiful as the sunrise. Oh, I'm going to start preaching.

Jennifer Rothschild: Ooh, that's good.

K.C. Wright: Jennifer, by the way, is singing at the end of this episode, so do stay with us. And we know how much you love that because of your reviews. And thank you for leaving us such great comments and reviews. It helps us really to know what you like and how we can meet your needs.

In fact, let me give a shout out right now to one of our 4:13ers. Ann from California says this. "I wait for Thursday." That is so kind.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know.

K.C. Wright: She waits for the podcast to drop on Thursdays. She went on to say, "I have listened ever since it launched. I love to hear the smiles in your voices and your easy laughs and awesome sense of humor. God bless you both." Well, God bless you back, Ann.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know.

K.C. Wright: How sweet.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know. Thanks, Ann. We really do read these reviews. So thank you.

So let's get right to it, though, K.C. Okay?

K.C. Wright: Let's do it.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right. 4:13 question for today is, "Can I overcome sadness?" And the answer is, yes, you can. And here's the thing. We can't always prevent sadness, but we can prevent sadness from hijacking our lives. So you may be having a great day, and I promise you this is going to make your day better. You may have a difficult day or a difficult season, and I promise you this is going to give you some practical encouragement that will also make your day better.

Because we've all gone through seasons and situations where there's sadness. In fact, I've got a friend who's been in a deep season of sadness, and she sent me a text recently that I want to tell you about. But before I tell you about the text, you've got to know something about this girl. She is like a Tigger on steroids. She's like K.C. Okay? She's happy, optimistic, positive, upbeat, and she's always hopeful. And so this particular day when she sent the text -- let me just try to read it for you. And by the way, if you don't know, I'm blind. So when I read a text, it means -- I actually have in a little ear plug and I just swipe my iPhone and it reads it to me. So here's what it said. "We are overcome with deep sadness to be at this point."

Now, before I read you the rest, let me tell you what this point was for her. Her and her husband had been really dealing with her mom. Her mom had been in and out of institutions because of mental illness, and now they had to make this super hard, difficult, soul-tearing decision about the mom's guardianship because they just couldn't take care of her any longer. See, for years they had tried. They'd emptied their savings for the best treatment centers. They'd prayed, they'd fought, they'd trusted. They never gave up hope. They did everything that you and I would do for someone we love. But on that particular day, they had to have her institutionalized, and they just felt like they were giving her up to an uncertain future. I mean, that's sad. That is deep sadness that washes in with that kind of decision.

But this is how she finished her text. Okay? She said, "We are trusting. Our Father knows and he is near." I mean, that's the truth. No matter how bleak things seemed or how sad she felt, she knew deep down that God was with them, and somehow, no matter how it looked, he was involved, he was in charge, and he was in control.

K.C. Wright: But just because you trust completely doesn't mean you won't feel completely sad sometimes.

Jennifer Rothschild: True.

K.C. Wright: When loss happens or disappointment is great and big, we feel sad. When hard things last a really long time, we can feel down, low, depressed, like sadness is just a part of our heartbeat.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. You're right. Let's get official, though, and let's define sadness. Okay? What exactly is it so we'll know what we're talking about. I'll give you a definition. Sadness is emotional pain that comes from loss, despair, grief, sorrow, or helplessness. Okay, did you get that? Sadness is an emotion. It's an emotional pain that you feel because of loss, despair, grief, sorrow, or helplessness. And the bummer is there's no way to erase it. It's not like you can go to a happy theme park and ride rides and eat cotton candy to make sadness go away. You may be able to distract yourself, or you may be able to displace that sadness for a little while, but you can't make it go away totally. And you can't talk yourself out of sadness either any better than you can talk yourself out of being hungry. You just are. And so it's a reality we need to understand and accept.

So what do you do, though, when you're just plain sad? If you can't fix it, how do you feel it and keep yourself above water? Sometimes all we can really do is kind of stay on top of it to keep it from ruling our lives. So I'm going to give you six strategies, six ways to overcome sadness so it doesn't overcome you.

K.C. Wright: And remember, these will all be on the Show Notes. So if you are on the move right now, we totally get it. And if you can't take notes, we got you covered. Jenn has got the notes for you. Just simply go to the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/40 to get all these six strategies that I know will help and impact thousands of lives. So, let's hear them.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay.

K.C. Wright: Okay, now tell us.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right. I'm going to give you six. Here's number one: Cry. Cry. Now, for some of you, that's the most natural response to sadness, right? You're like a Niagara at the drop of a tissue. Okay? But for others, crying feels like weakness. How many times have you been with somebody and they start to cry? And what's the first thing they say? "I'm sorry, I'm sorry." There's nothing to be sorry about. When we are sad, it's healthy to express that sadness and to cry. Because Jesus cried. I mean, think of it. When he stood before Lazarus' tomb, he didn't try to hold it in, and he didn't apologize for weeping; he just wept. He just wept. That's a response to sadness that's so healthy. When we cry, we express sadness.

But if you don't express your sadness, what is the opposite? It is repressing your sadness. And here's the thing. Repression will lead to depression. It will make it so much worse. All that sorrow has to go somewhere. Some studies suggest that when you cry, your body actually will relax. And it releases endorphins, which are a natural feel-good kind of chemical in your body. God designed you with tear ducts for a reason. So let your tears help you heal. And remember that your tears are always safe with God.

K.C. Wright: And, men, if Jesus cried, so can you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: This is permission. You can cry. Like Jenn said, it's healing for your soul. So I love that God equipped us in advance for the sorrow we would feel. He gave us tears, so we should just go ahead and cry when we feel it. Remember, your tears are always safe with him. And someone once said our tears are sometimes the only words the heart can express.

Okay, second way.

Jennifer Rothschild: Second way. Okay. Second way is exercise. I know, I know you might be cringing right now, because it's the last thing on our minds when we just want to curl up on the couch and drown our sorrows in a gallon of Chunky Monkey ice cream. Okay, notice I didn't even say a pint. I said a gallon of Chunky Monkey.

But God created our bodies to have and to need an escape valve for all the pressure of sadness, and exercise is a great way to release it. Now, this doesn't mean you have to go do some major workout. It might just mean a walk. But doing something physical will truly help you release your sadness. And not only does exercise release endorphins that make us feel better, it also makes us focus on something other than our sadness while we're working out. So if you're in a season where sadness is your constant companion, why don't you take it on a run or take it to an aerobics class with you. Chances are your sadness will not be able to keep up. Okay? And it will leave you alone for that spell while you sweat it out at the gym, and then when you're done, you'll be amazed at the lift that you will feel.

Okay, third way. Number three, smile.

K.C. Wright: Smiling is my favorite. Remember what Buddy the Elf said? "I just like to smile. Smiling is my favorite."

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, gosh.

K.C. Wright: Sorry. I'm sorry.

Jennifer Rothschild: I'm always up for an Elf quote. Always up for an Elf quote.

But here's the thing. It doesn't feel that way. Smiling does not feel like our favorite when we're sad, though, right? But here's the thing that's interesting to think about, y'all. You're not being a fake if you smile even when you're sad. You're being smart. Because studies actually show that smiling, even when you're sad, can help you feel better. Not only has research shown that smiling helps, but it also has shown that the opposite is true too. Frowning makes your sadness worse.

It's so interesting that our face can inform how we feel. It can be like a cue, like a nod, like, hey, this is how you're feeling right now. We always think of it the other way -- right? -- that our face reflects how we feel. But that's so interesting that we can act our way into a feeling. We can smile our way into a better mood or we can frown ourselves into feeling more deep sadness. So if you're sad, just try smiling. In fact, if you're having a bad day right now, wherever you are listening to this podcast, why don't you just do a big toothy grin. Look around and smile at people. Okay? At least you'll feel better because you'll see the funny looks that they're giving you when you do it. So if you're sad, just seriously, try smiling and see how you feel.

Okay, let's go to the fourth way. Fourth way is to listen to music. So listening to music, you can imagine, it can help soothe or relax you, right? And it can also help you have your focus shifted on to something higher and better and more beautiful. I mean, think about this. For a believer in Christ, this is like kryptonite for us. It unleashes all the power of the presence of God in our life as we join in worship. Especially when we're just praising the Lord or listening to Scripture, it can usher in healing. And I used to listen to these CDs -- this was many years ago -- and it was nothing but Scripture songs. Just literally the Word of God put to music. That Word will lift your spirits. But I will say this. When I say listen to music, I don't mean you go turn on all the sad '70s songs you used to listen to that are bleak or sad, or even today just put on some instrumental with some beautiful cello. I mean, it's beautiful to listen to, but it might make you feel a little more sad. Choose wisely the music you listen to.

And if you're having struggles with being focused, then make sure you listen to music that already contains lyrics, lyrics to which you want to aspire, lyrics that bring praise to the Lord, lyrics that state God's Word, and it will help you and it will lift your spirit. And think about this. When you're listening to praise music, you're experiencing God's presence, because Scripture says he inhabits the praises of his people.

I'm so serious about this, K.C., that I even have my Happy Happy Happy playlist. That's what I call it, Happy Happy Happy. That was before I knew Duck Dynastic guy said that. But I called it my Happy Happy Happy playlist.

K.C. Wright: Love it.

Jennifer Rothschild: And I still -- I mean, the songs on it are a little older now, but they still lift my spirit. I use the discipline of music when I'm frustrated or struggling with sadness or depression. I also have a playlist that's just songs about Heaven, because Heaven makes me happy, and so it lifts my spirits.

K.C. Wright: I love that. Oh, yeah, there's power in praise. I've got my praise songs on my phone too. And there's so much power when we fill our ears to fill our hearts with worship songs, because it gets our mind off of maybe the pit, the mountain, or the problem that's in front of us and lifts us our eyes to our Heavenly Father who has the answer for any problem we are facing in life.

Okay. Fifth way, Jenn. Fifth way.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, number five. Hang out with others. Hang out with others. You know, when you're really sad, it's often a very natural response to just isolate, to just be by yourself, me, myself, and I. But what happens is that leads to me, myself, and lies, and we start to believe untruths as we isolate ourselves. We want to stay home, we want to watch sad movies, we want to thumb through all those pictures that represent all that we've lost. But you don't need to do that in the first place. But if you're going to do that, then I'm going to ask you to get a buddy to come over and commiserate with you. Don't be alone if you're struggling with sadness.

I read some research one time that said that as you interact with loved ones, it literally increases your body's production of oxytocin, which helps to boost your mood. And studies also show that retreating from others -- and this makes total sense to you -- just makes depression worse. So if you're sad, don't wait until you feel better to hang out with a friend. Okay? Hang out with a friend and then see how it will make you feel better. Be brave. Take the risk, make the phone call, and just go be with somebody. Even if you don't have anybody available, go to a coffee shop where there are people around. Just that sense of not being isolated will help reduce some of your sense of sadness.

K.C. Wright: You may have a friend who is dealing with a hard situation feeling sad. Reach out to them with this podcast. I'm encouraging you to do that. Invite them to have coffee or go for a walk and listen. That way, you're exercising, you're helping them not isolate, you're listening to music. Hello. And remember, Jennifer will be singing at the end of this, and I am sure you will both be smiling by the end of that. So did you see how many ways --

Jennifer Rothschild: I know, that was impressive.

K.C. Wright: -- there are to overcome sadness that you'll be doing all at once?

Jennifer Rothschild: I know, you put that all in one sentence. Well done.

K.C. Wright: Okay. Keep us going, Jennifer. What is number six?

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, number six. This is the last one. Still your soul. Still your soul. Now, what do I mean by that? I mean take time to pray and meditate on Scripture. When sadness is pressing in, you need to invite God into your sadness. Pray to him because he hears you and he cares. And meditate on comforting Scriptures. If you don't choose to meditate on the Word, you're going to meditate on the worst. Okay? I'm going to say that again. If you don't choose to meditate on the Word, you will meditate on the worst.

Because often when we're sad, we're meditating on our loss or our sorrow or the fear or the what-if or how we wish things had turned out. So turn that pondering into prayer and just move that meditation on sorrow and loss into meditation on God's Word. It can really lift your spirits, and it will relieve some of the sadness. It'll give you perspective.

K.C. Wright: Sadness is really just a part of being human.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, it is.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to Planet Earth. But God has a hope and a future for all of us, and it is a future full of joy and victory. You're not a victim; you're a victor. So if you tuned in because you saw the title and thought, "That's me," you won't always feel this way, I promise. So when sadness hits, just hit back with these six strategies.

But ultimately, our heart is just to tell you to trust God. Trust God with your sadness, because he is the Great Physician and he makes house calls. He is with you right now. He will never leave you, nor forsake you. He is with you always until the end. And here's truth, heavenly truth. We never walk alone. And Dr. Jesus, not only does he prescribe, but he is the best medicine. He is with you right now in your sadness. So walk with him today, smile with him, and cry. Let it out. He will wipe your tears. Pop on over to the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/40 right now. Jenn's list of these six strategies are there just for you.

And from our hearts to you, never ever forget that you always have a friend. He is with you in your sadness. He understands. He celebrates with you, he walks with you, and he gives you all the strength you need. There is no one like Jesus. So whatever you face, however you feel, you can do all things through Christ who really does give you strength, supernatural strength. I can.

Jennifer Rothschild: I can.

Jennifer and K.C.: And you can.

Jennifer Rothschild: (Singing) There's not a friend like the lowly Jesus -- No, not one! No, not one! None else could heal all our soul's diseases -- No, not one! No, not one! Jesus knows all about our struggles, He will guide till the day is done; There's not a friend like the lowly Jesus -- No, not one! No, not one!

No friend like him is so high and holy -- No, not one! No, not one! And yet no friend is so meek and lowly -- No, not one! No, not one! Jesus knows all about our struggles, He will guide till the day is done; There's not a friend like the lowly Jesus -- No, not one! No, not one! No, not one! No, not one! There's not one like you. No, not one! No, not one! There's not one like you.

There's not an hour that He is not near us -- No, not one! No, not one! No night so dark that his love can't cheer us -- No, not one! No, not one! Jesus knows all about our struggles, He will guide till the day is done; There's not a friend like the lowly Jesus -- No, not one! No, none like you, Lord. No, not one! No, not one! There's not one like you. No, not one! No, not one! There's not one like you. No, not one! No, not one. There's not one like you.

4:13 Podcast: Can I Show Good Judgment Without Being Judgmental? [Episode 304]

K.C. Wright: We are right in the middle of a Summer Sizzle around here, and we're so glad you joined us for your most shared, hottest episodes. This is Episode 304, and Jennifer will answer a 4:13 question that we all wonder about: Can I show good judgment without being judgmental? I told you, it's going to be hot.

Well, you know the answer to the question is yes, you can. But you'll find out how based on God's Word and some really practical encouragement, we can get through this together. So get ready to get blessed. Here we go.

Jennifer Rothschild: She should not have done that. How could she even think that? I cannot believe she actually went there. I would never do that. Sound familiar? Anyone ever whispered those kind of things in your ear? Or have you ever muttered them under your breath? I've heard that kind of stuff and I've said that junk, and I've thought it too. When it comes to being judgmental, I admit, I have absolutely blown it. But I don't want to be a judgmental woman. I want to be a woman of good judgment. So today we're going to determine the difference. I'll also tell you four ways to know if you have a judgmental spirit and how to choose discernment instead.

This is going to be a really good and interesting podcast, so stick around so we can figure this out together. K.C., let's get official.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you up to live the "I Can" life, because you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, welcome your host -- she's never met a pizza that she didn't like -- Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: Hey, welcome. I'm glad you're here. I am Jennifer, self-proclaimed pizza lover, and I'm here to help you be and do more than you even feel capable of by living this "I Can" life of Philippians 4:13. The truth is, you can do all things through Christ who gives you strength.

And listen, let me just -- every now and then on the podcast I need to clarify this. That doesn't mean all things as in I can win the lottery, I can become a famous actor. No. What this verse is referring to is that you can do whatever God calls you to do. You have all the equipment you need to live the life in Christ that he chose for you. So that means you can forgive, you can trust, you can risk, you can have faith, you can be content, not through your own strength, but through Christ's strength. And I will say a pizza does help every now and then. Just kidding.

I'm a big margherita pizza fan. Thin crust. The thinner, the better. I love the brick oven. K.C., what's your deal with pizza? What's your favorite?

K.C. Wright: I am not a fan of pizza, and it's just because of all these years of youth ministry.

Jennifer Rothschild: I had no idea.

K.C. Wright: When you're a youth pastor, you order pizza. It's like every Friday night when the kids get together, let's order pizza. And after 20 years of pizza, you're fried on it.

Jennifer Rothschild: So we're, like, unequally yoked.

K.C. Wright: With just this one thing.

Jennifer Rothschild: With just this one thing.

K.C. Wright: I'm still your little brother.

Jennifer Rothschild: You are. You still are the boy version.

K.C. Wright: I'm the male version of you without the stilettos.

Jennifer Rothschild: You are.

Well, I'll tell you what happened. This is really funny. I thought it was funny in an ironic way. I was writing my first book, "Lessons I Learned in the Dark," and it took me about six, seven months to write it. And so I ordered a lot of pizza. We had two little kids at the time at home. And I remember the night I called Papa John's Pizza. And, you know, you give your phone number? And as soon as I gave my phone number, the lady said, "Congratulations. This is your 100th pizza."

K.C. Wright: Oh, my word.

Jennifer Rothschild: In like six months. I couldn't believe it.

But here's what's wrong. And any of you Papa John's employees, I just want to let you know -- I'm registering my complaint on the podcast -- I did not get a free pizza.

K.C. Wright: You should have so --

Jennifer Rothschild: I'm telling you.

K.C. Wright: -- received a free pizza.

Jennifer Rothschild: But it's okay. It's okay. I'm happy to give my money to the Papa John's Pizza Company. They do good pizza, and they served as well, and they kept my children fed during that year of writing the book. So really, that has nothing to do with anything. Okay?

K.C. Wright: No. We just like talking about food.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, we do.

K.C. Wright: Today's 4:13 question is this: Can I show good judgment without being judgmental?

Jennifer Rothschild: Ooh. It's a good topic today, I'm serious. Because we don't want to be judgy, right? We want to show good judgment. And there's a difference. When we show good judgment, we're applying discernment. And that's the kind of people we want to be.

Discernment can see right and wrong. That's what discernment is. Discernment is able to judge rightly. When you're showing good judgment, or discernment, when you discern something that isn't quite right, like, it strikes this chord in you, right? It just -- this chord in your heart doesn't sound right, doesn't feel right. And it's usually an out-of-tune dissonant chord. It's like smelling something that's kind of stinky and wondering what it is and wanting to sniff out the source. It's a spiritually mature impulse to be discerning.

K.C. Wright: But we can take that good impulse and turn it into bad behavior. Just as quick as a toddler goes from total contentment to a total meltdown --

Jennifer Rothschild: That's true.

K.C. Wright: -- we can go from good judgment to being downright judgy. When we're discerning, it should never puff us up or go to our heads.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: Then we become full of ourselves and risk becoming judgmental. It's all in how we handle the discernment. You know, God never called us to judge people. If you think you're called to judge people, you're going to become fault finding, critical, and negative. But if you love people the way God loves them, his love through you will change them quicker than you could ever imagine.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. I mean, we need humility, right? And we need wisdom. And so let me just get right to it, okay? How do we really know? How do we know if we're being judgmental -- okay? -- if we've slipped from showing good judgment or having discernment to becoming judgmental? I'm going to give you four ways. And this could hurt. Okay? Because I'm just going to say, as I thought through this and prayed through this, it was very convicting.

All right. First way, if you are quick to elevate yourself.

K.C. Wright: Ooh.

Jennifer Rothschild: If I'm quick to elevate me, that might mean that I am being a little bit judgmental. So do I feel better about me because someone else is so much worse than I am? If we observe someone's brokenness and we go straight to pride about how whole we think we are, then we're being judgmental. Knowing the truth of Scripture and using it as a magnifying glass to point out what someone else is doing wrong, so that it can spotlight what we're doing right, is a big red flag that we're in judging mode.

Discernment is always Spirit led. Being judgmental, though, it's always going to spring from our flesh. So when we see something wrong in another person's life, we shouldn't think worse about that person. Instead, we should feel worse for that person. It should bring out compassion and empathy. Discernment shows compassion; but judgment, hmm-mm, it always swells with pride.

So another person's mistake should not make us feel better about us, but worse for that person. That person needs our sympathy, not our censorship. The ground at the foot of the Cross, it is absolutely perfectly level. There's no high, there is no low. We all stand level at the foot of the Cross. I'm not higher, she's not lower, you're not higher, I'm not lower. So if we really want to determine am I being judgmental or do I have a judgmental spirit, we ask, "Am I quick to elevate myself?" Okay? That's the question you ask, "Am I quick to elevate myself?"

Second question that you ask, "Am I quick to gossip?" Okay? Because that's a symptom of a judgmental spirit. If you are quick to gossip, chances are it means you have a judgmental spirit. So, like, if I see something questionable in someone's life, do I go talk to God about it or do I talk to everyone else about it? Discernment leads to discretion. Judgment leads to gossip. So think about that. What do you do when you observe something in someone's life? Are you quick to tell everybody about it or do you go straight to the Lord, if you've got to talk about it, and you talk to him? Gossip is the megaphone of a judgmental spirit. And if we're quick to share the, Oh, my gosh, you won't believe, or, Did you hear that, you know, chances are we've jumped on our high horses and we're galloping up that high hill of judgmentalism.

Before we ever talk about anybody, or even to that person that we've observed something, we must talk to God. And when we talk to God, that person does not need to be the main character of our prayer and not the first person that we're talking about. We need to be. We need to have a right spirit. We seek to be pure before the Lord and ask him to affirm what we've discerned, and to humble us and to forgive us from any critical spirit. Then if he leads us, we talk to that person.

Okay, but pause here, my Christian brothers and sisters. We don't talk about those people that we may have discerned something in their life. We don't talk about that person. Sometimes what we do, we act like we're not doing it when we really are. Because we gossip in the form -- and it's a spiritually acceptable form -- of giving our prayer requests. We have to pay attention to that. We don't need prayer requests on a Sunday morning to be a form of sharing gossip. We do pray for each other and we give them the dignity and the respect that they deserve. So even if you notice that their behavior doesn't warrant respect, that's okay. They do, because they, just like you and just like me, are loved by God. So if we want to discern if we're having a judgmental spirit, we need to ask, "Am I quick to gossip?"

Okay, I'm going to head to the third one, but I'm going to give you a chance to breathe.

K.C. Wright: This is so good, Jenn.

Jennifer Rothschild: And it's convicting, isn't it?

K.C. Wright: Mm-hmm. It's what I call an ouch hallelujah.

Jennifer Rothschild: Because even as I'm sharing it, K.C., in my mind I see these little snapshots of times and people and situations where I have clearly been judgmental.

K.C. Wright: Well, I always think, too -- let's say we see a brother or sister in some kind of sin. Okay?

Jennifer Rothschild: Mm-hmm.

K.C. Wright: This person has -- we may not know -- admitted their sin to God, asked him to forgive them --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yep.

K.C. Wright: -- and he takes our sins as far as the east is from the west. He remembers them no more. He places them in the sea of forgetfulness. As though they are as red as scarlet, he makes them whiter as snow. So they are forgiven and we're talking about their sin. So we are automatically on the other guy's team --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: -- and he's the accuser of the brethren.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, that's so good.

K.C. Wright: So when you're talking about somebody else's sin, they may have already repented and you're accusing, and that's not the side you want to be on.

Jennifer Rothschild: It's not.

K.C. Wright: No.

Jennifer Rothschild: I'm glad you said that. Because the enemy of our souls is an accuser. We're not on his team.

K.C. Wright: Right.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. Let's go to the third one then. Here's another way to know if you have a judgmental spirit. "Am I quick to critique?" "Am I a critic?" Okay. Do I have a critical spirit when it comes to another person's behavior, or do I have a compassionate perspective? Judgmental people are critical of others. If she did it wrong or not in the way I would have done it, well, then she's subject to my criticism and my critique. Judgment is quick to critique. Discernment, though, shows compassion. Compassion tries to see all sides of an issue. Compassion, it feels love, where judgment thinks legalism.

We've all blown several of the thou shalt and the thou shalt nots, right? But God does not treat us as our sins deserve. That's what Psalm 1:10 says. That's what K.C. just talked about. He shows us compassion. And so if we're truly discerning, then we discern the compassion that God has already given us and we give it to others. So ask yourself, "Am I quick to critique others?" That's a way to know if you have a judgmental spirit.

Okay. Fourth one, last one, way to know if you have a judgmental spirit. "Am I quick to conclude?" Do I come to a really quick and easy conclusion or do I consider what could be going on in that person's life? You know, there's a tip to every iceberg. And honestly, that's all you can see, right? We don't know what's underneath. So if you assess a whole iceberg from the tiny tip that you can see, chances are you'll have no real idea of what's under the surface. Sure, you may see behavior that is wrong or questionable. Sure, we can always discern that with good judgment, right? But knowing someone's behavior is wrong and choosing to determine that that person has the wrong motive or the wrong intention, that's not the same things.

So when we're judgmental, we use our good judgment as if it's this crystal ball through which we -- and only us, by the way, we alone -- can figure out every single thing about someone else's heart. You know we can't do that. And even if we could, we shouldn't. It's not our business to come to a complete conclusion about someone's motives. Instead of concluding, we need to just consider. We need to pause. We use our discernment to think more deeply, to imagine what that person might be dealing with or how they could potentially be misguided to say such a thing or act that way. Because often people are misguided. Sometimes it's not just arrogance that makes people make the choices they do. Sometimes it's ignorance. Sometimes they really just don't know.

So we consider how we can be part of a solution rather than add to the problem. Judgment knows everything without inspection. Okay? A judgmental spirit knows everything without ever inspecting a situation. But discernment humbly seeks wisdom. That's some pretty --

K.C. Wright: Good stuff.

Jennifer Rothschild: I had to pause, because it's pretty convicting, isn't it?

K.C. Wright: It's good stuff.

Jennifer Rothschild: It's good stuff.

K.C. Wright: It's convicting. But God is the only wise judge.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: And aren't you thankful he judges with mercy. So if we're starting to get judgy, let's fall off our high horses --

Jennifer Rothschild: Or high heels.

K.C. Wright: -- there you go -- and land on our knees before God. Let's humble ourselves before the Lord, seek his forgiveness, and ask him for his merciful heart for us. I want to be a guy who judges rightly and at the same time loves generously.

Jennifer Rothschild: Me too. So to be those people who can discern and have good judgment rather than being judgmental -- and this will be for you note takers. Okay? I'm going to give you four things. And if you're on the move right now driving, or on the treadmill or taking a walk with your BFF or doing the dishes, these will all be on the Show Notes. And you can go there at 413podcast.com/37 to find all this. Okay?

So let me give you four ways to be discerning. Okay? So instead of being quick to elevate me, I need to be quick to humble myself. Okay? Instead of being quick to elevate myself, I need to be quick to humble myself, to choose humility. James 4 tells us that we can humble ourselves in the sight of the Lord. And when we do, he's the one who lifts us up.

Sometimes the reason we elevate ourselves is because deep down on the inside we feel small. And if we can make someone else look smaller than us, then we feel bigger. When really the way to truly be your right size in your spirit before the Lord is to be humble, and then he's the one that lifts you up. His esteem for you is adequate. So instead of being a person who elevates ourselves, let's be people who choose humility. If you want to grow in your discernment, choose humility. Okay?

Another one, instead of being quick to gossip, I need to be quick to pray. Quick to pray. So since gossip is something we do with words, we just need to immediately transfer that to prayer, to take those same words that would be used as weapons and use them in prayer as something that can be a tool of healing, not only for the person who we were concerned with, but for our own hearts. 1 Thessalonians 5:16-17 tells us that we're to rejoice always -- right? --but we are to pray without ceasing.

K.C. Wright: So good.

Jennifer Rothschild: That means if you keep a spirit of prayer, it's going to be really hard for you to gossip.

K.C. Wright: That's so good.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, third way. If you think you are quick to critique, then instead of being quick to critique, you can become quick to build up. I love this. And that's why we do this podcast. We want to choose encouragement.

So, K.C., there's a verse in Ephesians. Will you read that one for us.

K.C. Wright: Ephesians 4:29 says this, "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out from your mouths, but only that which is useful for building up." And, you know, we've done a podcast on this, too, our thought life.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yep.

K.C. Wright: Not only are we to speak words of life over others, but we're supposed to be speaking life over ourselves as well.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, we are.

K.C. Wright: Yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: And when we're more concerned about our own spiritual humility and our responsibility of encouraging others, we're less likely to be critical.

Okay, let me give you another one. Instead of being quick to conclude, I need to be much more slow to form an opinion. Instead, I need to choose thoughtfulness. Now, this one's hard for me. Because there are slow deciders and there are quick deciders, and I tend to be a quick decider. And I think I know. I have a quick opinion and I think that's the final word on a matter, and it's not. But, see, as the Lord is teaching me humility and the importance of encouragement, then I am far less quick to form an opinion, and more slow about that, so I become more thoughtful.

Okay, K.C., I want you to read this last verse, because I think it's interesting. It talks about the importance of being slow to form an opinion instead of being quick to conclude.

K.C. Wright: Proverbs 10:19. "When words are many, transgressions are not lacking, but whoever restrains his lips is prudent."

Jennifer Rothschild: Wow.

K.C. Wright: We all need self-control, humility, and thoughtfulness. I know I do. I sure do. I'm raising my hand. You can't see this --

Jennifer Rothschild: Me too.

K.C. Wright: -- but I got my hand up. We can become people who are discerning and have good judgment. What I think Jenn is communicating here so well is we are to judge ourselves. Judge the weight of sin. Judge fruit, the righteous from the unrighteous. Judge the way to help those in sin. Judge our own spiritual strength so as not to become ensnared ourselves as we help remove the weight of sin from others and so much more. This is truly the love walk. We must judge without condemnation.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's right. Because that is good judgment. That's discernment.

K.C. Wright: And the good news is we can do all things through Christ who gives us strength. You can do this too. You can do all things through Christ's power in you. All you simply do is ask him to make you a person of good judgment. And the world needs fewer judgmental experts --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: -- and far more humble, discerning, loving Jesus following people with good hearts and good judgment.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. And you are that person. You can be that person through Christ. So remember, whatever situation you're in, whatever relationships, whatever tendencies you may have, you can take them before the Lord, and where you are weak, he will give you strength. And the reason is you can do all things through Christ who gives you strength. I can.

K.C. Wright: I can.

Jennifer and K.C.: And you can.

K.C. Wright: I'm so judging you for ordering 100 pizzas. What were you thinking filling your children with that much grease?

Jennifer Rothschild: I think you need to listen to this podcast.

K.C. Wright: You are clogging their arteries.

4:13 Podcast: Can I Trust God When Life Is Scary? [Episode 303]

K.C. Wright: It is hot out there, and that means it's time again for a Summer Sizzle episode on The 4:13. We've been featuring your most shared episodes, and they've been so practical and inspiring.

Well, today on Episode 303, Jennifer is answering another 4:13 question: Can I trust God when life is scary? And we all face hard things that absolutely freak us out and make us want to hide. So today you will get the biblical wisdom and practical encouragement you need to face the hard things with faith and punch fear in the face with the Word of God.

So here we go, family.

Jennifer Rothschild: When we're hurting, our heads are cloudy and our hearts feel so heavy that we just feel we can't bear the weight of our next decision. You know what I'm talking about? We feel stressed and disoriented and we don't always feel capable of pulling off the small things that we need to do, much less the big things that our soul really needs, like trusting God and praying. I've been there. When I was facing all the unknowns that go with a lumpectomy, the simplest tasks felt so complicated. And the big spiritual ones? Well, they weren't easy either.

So today I'm going to give you a Scripture-based to-do list for when you're hurting, and it's going to help you get through those stressful, hurtful, difficult situations. Hope and health is on the way, and so is my friend K.C. So take it away, brother.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you to live the "I Can" life, because you, my friend, can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, here she is with her 4:13 mug full of black coffee, Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, because strong women drink strong coffee.

And I'll tell you, K.C., I'm dealing with allergies. So I know you can probably hear in my voice if you've listened to us for a while, I sound just a little bit like I've got something in there. I do. And so I'm trying to flush it out with black coffee. But I am here to help you be and do more than you feel capable of by living this "I Can" life of Philippians 4:13. You can do all things through Christ who gives you strength.

K.C. Wright: It's just two friends, one topic, and zero stress every single week. And can we just say, seriously, thank you for listening. Can I just put that right in here? Our hearts give you a standing ovation for making us a part of your week, week after week. We cannot thank you enough for listening, for sharing, and for writing a very kind review.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: And actually, before we get to the 4:13 question, I got to give a shout out to some of you 4:13ers who left such great comments and reviews. This is from JesusRadioGirl. I love that.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know. It's a great name.

K.C. Wright: She said, "Best use of my time connecting here. I get excited when I see a new episode notification. It's a highlight in a great day. And in a not-so-great day, it's hope-filled truth to steer my mind and heart back to an attitude of perseverance. So thanks for making us smile and bringing a light-hearted atmosphere. Truly, this gathering is a soft place to land, but with encouragement to get us back up again. After all, it is about Philippians 4:13."

Jennifer Rothschild: Isn't that great?

K.C. Wright: And Jen11-10 said it is perfect for her. She's from Springfield, has so much in common with Jennifer. She could listen every day if there were enough episodes. She loves how spiritually practical this podcast is. And that's an answer to one of our prayers, that review, because that's our heart. We want to be real, we want to be practical.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yep.

K.C. Wright: We don't want to tie a little spiritual bow onto the most painful things in life. We want to be authentic and true and just us.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: And we can do all things through Christ who strengthen us.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's right.

K.C. Wright: Thank you so much.

Jennifer Rothschild: But we do appreciate your reviews. We appreciate you. So thank you so much.

And, you know, that leads us to this idea of how we can do all things. Right? How is it? Especially how can we trust God when life is scary? Because you may be facing something, or you may know someone who is, that is just draped in uncertainty. You just don't know what's going to happen. You may have gotten a diagnosis, you may have had a job change, your child may have made a decision that has kind of jarred your world, and you really need to trust God because life is scary. And so that's what we're going to talk about today, how you can do that. And I've actually got you a spiritual to-do list based on Scripture that, of course, you can do through God's grace, because you can do all things through Christ who gives you strength.

And so before I share with you what that verse is and what the to-do list is, let me tell you when I created this to-do list. It was several years ago. And like many women, I had gone to a mammogram. And this particular time, though, I got a call back. And when I got the call back, of course I had to do another biopsy. And then I get a call -- I'm speeding through this story, by the way, for you. I get another phone call from a surgeon. Okay? Now, it was set up as an appointment for this surgeon to call me and my husband, Phil. And so I remember us sitting in my office, and we had the phone on speaker sitting in front of us. And the surgeon explained that they had detected, of course in both breasts, two places that really -- they looked like some angry cells that needed to come out because they were dangerous.

And so in this conversation, as the doctor is explaining this to me and explaining what the procedure would be, he's, of course, giving all the logistics. And I'm thinking, as he's saying all this, oh, my goodness, Aunt Carol just had breast cancer. And Aunt Carol had a mastectomy. And we all know the genetic influence in family members when it comes to breast cancer, so, of course, I got to be honest, I was getting scared. And when the surgeon finished all of his conversation and we thanked him and said goodbye, my husband looks over at me and he says, "Okay. It'll be okay. It'll be okay." And I remember when he said that, I thought, will it? It might not. It might not. It wasn't okay for Aunt Carol; it may not be okay.

But as I processed all that, I had this spiritual sense of the presence of the Lord that reminded me that even if it wasn't okay, I was going to be okay. Okay? Even if it wasn't going to be okay, I was going to be okay either way. And so the passage that I began to cling to right away -- because I didn't know what to do. I didn't know how to feel. That passage that I began to cling to right away was Proverbs 3:5-6. And it became for me this to-do list.

So, K.C., would you read us Proverbs 3:5-6.

K.C. Wright: Proverbs 3:5-6. "Trust in the Lord with all your heart. Lean not on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he, God, will direct your paths." And by the way, this verse is a free download. It's beautiful and will remind you of the truth you can trust God, whatever you face. When we're done, just simply go to the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/48 and you can download it right there just for you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. And those verses, I believe, can become for you, just like they did for me, kind of a spiritual to-do list. And so I'm going to break it down, because what happens when we've got something hard or difficult or scary or disorienting, truly, we can't figure out what to do. And so when this became for me a to-do list, I literally would run through it in my head. And I would just do what the verse said, and it helped me to process and get through. So if you're hurting, or if you know somebody who is, let me give you my three things. Okay? It's a three-thing to-do list. Okay?

First, trust in the Lord with all your heart. Okay? That's what the verse says, right? It begins with, "Trust in the Lord with all your heart." Okay, that's all your heart. Not just some of your heart. All of it. So to trust God with all of your heart means that you hold nothing back. You hold nothing back. You don't just trust him with the good stuff; you trust him with all your stuff. We often hold back part of our hearts because of fear, or maybe we just feel this need to self-protect. But y'all, this is God we're talking about here. He is totally worthy of your trust because he is totally trustworthy.

I remember when I laid on that hospital bed waiting for the procedure for the lumpectomy to begin -- you know how sometimes you have to wait, you get there early and you hurry up and wait? And I remember when I was laying there, that was all I prayed, "Lord, I trust you. With all I've got, I trust you. I trust you, Lord, with all I've got." Simple words. I know they're not easy to pray sometimes, and I know also they're not easy to mean, but you can pray that simple prayer, "Lord, I trust you with all of my heart." Because when we're hurting, what do we have to lose, right? You might as well trust him. You got nothing to lose.

I remember laying there with nothing but the potential of a bad outcome. But I also did have the potential of a good outcome. But, of course, what was I focusing on? What did my mind continually gravitate to? The potential bad outcome. Trusting God in that moment was the least risky and the most wise thing that I could do. So that's what I did with my whole heart, I trusted him. And I trusted him with the surgeon and I trusted him with the doctors and I trusted him with the outcome and I trusted him with my fear and I trusted him with the future.

So if you're hurting and you just absolutely don't know what to do, the first and best thing you can do is trust him with all you've got. And when you trust him with all you've got, then you realize he's really all you need.

K.C. Wright: We can trust him with everything in our lives. So don't just trust God with the good stuff; trust him with all your stuff.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, all your stuff.

Okay. Let me get to the second on the to-do list, and it's the second part of that verse. "Lean not on your own understanding." Lean not, or don't lean, on your own understanding. So think about it. When we're leaning on our own understanding, we're relying on ourselves, our wisdom and our plan. Think about it. What happens when you lean on something? Okay? Like, if you're in a position right now where you could just fully lean your weight on something, just do that for just a second. Just feel what it feels like to completely lean on something. So what's happening? When you lean on something, you're resting your weight on it, right? You expect that whatever you're leaning on is going to steady you and hold you up.

Now, our understanding is not always strong enough to lean on. Let's be super honest here. Our understanding is not always strong enough to lean our whole selves upon, to rest our whole weight upon, expecting that it's going to support us and hold us up. Now, it's our tendency to try to understand, to try to figure it out, to rely on our own plan, but we can't do that. And here's why. We don't see the whole picture, so we can't understand the whole plan. You cannot see the whole picture, so you cannot understand the whole plan.

K.C. Wright: When you lean on you, you just multiply the weight you are carrying. You feel like you've got the whole world on your shoulders, and then the smallest thing will just knock you over. That's why you need to lean on God instead. If he's got the whole world in his hands, like the song says, he's holding you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: So it's okay if you don't understand. You don't have to understand everything to trust in the living God who has begun a good work in you and will complete it until the day of Christ. And he's got you. He's got this. You can trust God with everything.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. I remember during that season, I didn't understand the why and the timing of my cancer scare. So I was diagnosed with the breast cancer right before -- or no, actually -- I'm sorry. It was just when I finished filming the videos for my Missing Pieces Bible study.

K.C. Wright: Wow.

Jennifer Rothschild: And you know what the subtitle of Missing Pieces is?

K.C. Wright: What?

Jennifer Rothschild: Real Hope When Life Doesn't Make Sense.

K.C. Wright: Oh, my goodness.

Jennifer Rothschild: Bingo.

K.C. Wright: Bingo.

Jennifer Rothschild: It didn't make any sense. It didn't make any sense to me. But here's the thing. It didn't have to. There's a great relief that we experience when we release our need to understand and just trust God anyway. So if you're hurting, don't lean on your own understanding. Your own understanding will always be incomplete. But instead, lean on God instead because his plan is complete and his provision will be complete for you.

K.C. Wright: Okay. Third way has to be the end of this verse.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: Right?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: "In all your ways, acknowledge him." Acknowledge God in all your ways.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes. Okay, that's exactly it. So when you're hurting, you might not know what to do. But there's still lots of things you have to do, right? I mean, there's the practical things you have to get done. And so sometimes when you're in that kind of fog, it's hard to just know how to continue to proceed. You just take the next right step. And as you do, you acknowledge him. Okay?

Now, what does that mean to acknowledge him? To acknowledge means that you know and you recognize. That's what it means to acknowledge something or someone. It means you know and you recognize. So when you trust God with all your heart, you're acknowledging, you're knowing, and you're recognizing that he is fully trustworthy. When you lean on him rather than your own understanding, you're acknowledging, you're knowing, you're recognizing that his ways may not be the same as your ways, but you can go with his way, right? When you acknowledge him, that means you're knowing and you're recognizing him. You are affirming that -- you're affirming what you know to be true about him, and then you're able to see that truth in your situation.

And so sometimes, guys, let's be honest, when you're in a difficult situation, even just making that phone call feels overwhelming. That's when you put your hand on the phone and you acknowledge him in all your ways. Lord, I trust you. Lord, I'm not leaning on my own understanding. Lord, I'm going to know and recognize that you are sovereign and in control right now, so help me to make this phone call. I'm acknowledging you in all my ways. It goes to that level of the intricacies of getting through something, just doing the next right thing. And it also applies to the big underpinnings of just praying and trusting, acknowledging him, knowing him, recognizing him in all your ways. So for me, acknowledging him in all my ways, it helped me to understand that no matter the outcome of my surgery, even if it wasn't going to be okay, that I was going to be okay.

So if you're hurting, acknowledge him. Know and recognize that he is with you, he's caring for you, he's supporting you, and he's making sure that you will be okay.

K.C. Wright: And then there is the result of those three things, and he will direct your paths.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, that's the last part.

K.C. Wright: It comes with a promise. God will direct your heart and your steps.

My friend, you don't have to know what to do. You can trust him. Lean more on his wisdom than your own and acknowledge him, and in that acknowledging and leaning, you will absolutely be blown away as he does truly direct you and your path. He makes the crooked path straight for you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, he does. You know, in my situation, K.C., the surgeon was able to get all those scary cells and all the compromised tissue out and so my margins came back clear. And that is like the best outcome -- right? -- that anyone could hope for when it comes to this, and I'm so grateful. And I know as you're listening, your outcome may have been different or someone you love may have had a very difficult outcome. And I hate that for you. My heart goes out to you. Because I stood on the edge of what that feels like, and it's scary.

But this I do know for me. My healing journey spiritually in my heart did not come from that good outcome. It happened all along the way as God continued to direct my path. He put me on a path of trusting him no matter what. He guided me down a path of dependence on him rather than depending on my own understanding and my own plans. He cleared the way before me so that I really could acknowledge him. I could know him, I could see him and recognize him in my hurt and in the whole process. So my friend, the best comfort and the best healing does not come from a great outcome. It comes from a relationship with God along the way. And that's what I want for you. So if you're hurting and you just do not know what to do, I promise you, God is right now clearing a way for you to walk in. He is doing this for you. He's directing your paths, so trust him and take the next step.

K.C. Wright: I've got to share real quick Proverbs 16:3 from the Amplified. "Roll your works upon the Lord. Commit and trust them wholly to him. He" -- God -- "will cause your thoughts to become agreeable to his will, and so shall your plans be established and succeed." That is a promise --

Jennifer Rothschild: That is a promise.

K.C. Wright: -- you can take to the bank.

You can get a free download of all these verses, Proverbs 3:5-6, at 413podcast.com/48. So go there and print one for you and somebody you know who needs some hope and encouragement.

And please do share this podcast too. And as you listened, you may have thought of a friend or a coworker. Share this with them. Remember, whatever you face, however you feel, remember you're never alone -- we never walk alone -- and you can do all things through Christ who gives you all the strength you need.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, you can.

4:13 Podcast: Can I Respond Well to the Grown-Up Mean Girl? [Episode 302]

K.C. Wright: It's summer and it's hot, so that means it's time for another one of our hottest episodes on The 4:13. It's what we call Summer Sizzle. And this episode, Episode 302, is another one of your most shared episodes. Jennifer will answer the 4:13 question, "Can I respond well to the grown-up mean girl?" Well, you know she's out there and you know the answer. Yes, you can respond well. And today, you and I will find out how you can handle those hard relationships and love ever so well, even when other grownups don't act their age. So let the podcast begin.

Jennifer Rothschild: Mean girls grow up, and it sure would be nice if all those years of living would make a mean girl a more gentle woman. But sometimes the mean girl just grows up into a mean woman. And I know this because I got an email from one of them. So today I want to share some very practical encouragement and biblical wisdom to help you the next time you deal with a mean girl who grew up without maturing. You're going to get four wise ways to manage the emotions that a grown-up mean girl brings out of you. So I want you to stay with me and K.C., because this is going to be a great use of your time today.

Take it away, K.C.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you up to live the "I Can" life, because you can really do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, your host, a woman who has a sassy streak of red in her hair today, Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: It's true. I'm Jennifer, and we're so glad you're here. We're just here to help you be and do more than you even feel capable of by living this 4:13 life. And I'm glad that we're keeping it real today, K.C.

K.C. Wright: Yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, I did just get my hair colored, and I'll tell you why.

K.C. Wright: It looks nice.

Jennifer Rothschild: Thank you, my friend.

You might be able to hear this in my voice, and you might be able to hear it in K.C.'s. We both have had a cold. And I have felt terrible.

K.C. Wright: A plague really.

Jennifer Rothschild: So when I finally felt well enough, I got my hair colored, because I figured at least I look better than I feel. But what'd you say? We've been riding on the cold train.

K.C. Wright: Oh, my goodness, yeah. And I'm excited. I think I'm almost off the cold train. But, you know, I wake up with so much joy in the morning and, boy, this cold just knocked it out of me. You wake up and you go, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" I mean, it's been rough. It really knocked us both out.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. I've had a lot of friends who've had it too. I hope you've been well out there. I hope you've not been down under the weather. But here's the thing. We push through and we --

K.C. Wright: That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: If we can't push through, we get our hair colored.

K.C. Wright: And -- yes. And thank God for Mucinex, which is not a sponsor of the podcast.

Jennifer Rothschild: No, but it sure should be. I went through two boxes.

K.C. Wright: And stay hydrated, my friends.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes, stay hydrated.

K.C. Wright: Stay hydrated.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's right. And that doesn't just mean with coffee.

K.C. Wright: And keeping it fun today, because today you're doing another installment of stuff I love at the end, of course. And it is a surprise.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: So stay with us to the very end of today's show for stuff I love with Jenn and her very own Dr. Phil.

Jennifer Rothschild: I'll give you a hint. Okay?

K.C. Wright: Oh, please do.

Jennifer Rothschild: Because -- in case you're new, you may not be aware that I'm blind, so I have certain gadgets that help me. And, in fact, I used this one in front of somebody the other day and they were like, "I'm not blind and I need that." Okay, that's all I'm going to tell you. But it all involves how I pour my coffee.

K.C. Wright: Ooh.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, let's get to the topic. Okay? Because this is -- we're going to deal with the 4:13 question today of how we can know to deal with a grown-up mean girl. Because, sadly, they exist. Not just grown-up mean girls, grown-up mean guys too. And I got an email from a grown-up mean girl. And I had never met this woman, and she doesn't know me. But after she read my bio on my website, she felt the need to give me what for. And can I be honest? I felt the same need. I was ready to give it right back to her. So I want to share with you just a part of her email, and then I'm going to give you my response. And so my response might help you know how to deal with a mean girl who grew up without maturing. Okay?

So, K.C., you're the Seeing Eye Guy, so I've printed this and I want you to read this to us.

K.C. Wright: Yeah, this is what the mean girl wrote to our Jenn. "In your bio, you write" --

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, okay. Thank you for your dramatic interpretation. I don't need you to do a dramatic interpretation.

K.C. Wright: I'm sorry. I am very -- I am very -- I am a protector of my sister.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know you are, and that's very awesome. Okay, but just read the email.

K.C. Wright: Okay.

"In your bio, you write, 'My bio is just a few chapters of His story.' That is a stunning statement. God's story is complete in Scripture. You seem to be elevating your life and its events with the Gospel message. Speaking of the Gospel message --

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, K.C., stop.

K.C. Wright: -- I don't see it in your bio. I see that you shy away from that word and the word "sin" as well. That's never a good sign. Your story is very secondary and quite irrelevant to His. Your words reveal your heart and your words say a lot about you. Where is your heart? Whom do you serve, God or yourself?"

Oh, man.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: Man.

Jennifer Rothschild: It wasn't very nice.

K.C. Wright: Oh, not kind.

Jennifer Rothschild: No, no.

K.C. Wright: But in 20 years of working in Christian radio, I've received many of these as well.

Jennifer Rothschild: Maybe you know her.

K.C. Wright: We call them crusaders.

Jennifer Rothschild: Maybe you know her.

Okay. Now, before I ask K.C. to read the response -- because I did respond to her. Okay? Before I ask him to read that, let me just make sure you know that I did remove a few sentences from her email that K.C. just read, because you didn't need to hear all of it to get the gist. Because believe me, she was prolific. There was more. Also I removed her name, of course, and anything that might reveal who she is, because I don't know her, and you don't know her either, and it really doesn't matter. We don't need to try to figure out who this person is. I just share it with you, not so that you'll get all fired up or try to figure out who she is. I share it so that we can all learn from it, as I did.

So, K.C., when I got that -- and, of course, my computer, of course, reads this to me. So as I am reading this, I'm hearing this, my fingertips are itching, man. I'm ready to write a response, right? So I quickly hit the reply button and I start typing. All right? Now, I'm going to ask K.C. to read to you what I wrote back to her.

K.C. Wright: Listen, Felicia, don't you make me take off my heels.

Jennifer Rothschild: That is not --

K.C. Wright: I will cut you, girl. I will cut you. Oh, no.

Jennifer Rothschild: That is not what I wrote. Okay, I apologize. He is a little fired up today. I did not write that, K.C.

K.C. Wright: She didn't. I'm just having fun.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know you are. You're hilarious.

K.C. Wright: I'm just having fun. That made somebody laugh.

Jennifer Rothschild: It made me laugh. This is why I love you.

Okay, now get with the picture. Read the email.

K.C. Wright: "Dear _______, your words were mean. I speak honestly because you seem to be okay with that. You could have shared your concerns with me with kindness and an open mind instead of a quick condemnation and accusation.

If your goal was to hurt me, you accomplished that. If your goal was to share your concerns, truly get clarification, then your email simply does not accomplish that. Your email was far more of an accusation than an inquiry.

To be honest, I hesitated to respond to you because I didn't want to support or respond to such a mean spirit. But for the sake of the Gospel, I will clarify.

My statement about my bio being a 'small part of His story' was not meant to elevate my story to the level of importance of the Gospel. I actually meant it to put my story into place, the small place it should be in comparison to God's big story and his big work.

Perhaps I could have written that in a way that in no way creates any confusion, or perhaps you can read it with different eyes: eyes of love, eyes of kindness. And if you read more than just my bio, if you read even a few of my Bible studies or books or blogs, you'll find the words "sin" and "repentance" offered in a very balanced way.

Unfortunately, you choose to judge me, my heart, and my ministry from a single bio, and I am very disappointed that you found it in your heart to shame me and condemn me. I could ask you the same: what is in your heart? But as I write this, I ask myself, am I just defending myself because you hurt me or am I trying to set another sister straight, as you did to me? Am I doing nothing out of selfishness and vain conceit, considering you more important than me, as Philippians says?

I think I am attempting to do to you what you did to me: hurt me. So I will not send you this email, even though every part of my flesh wants to, even though the truth teller in me wants to.

So what should I do?

I guess I will just wipe my tears, give them to God, and tell you that in Christ I am made new, forgiven, and loved. He has forgiven me of all my sin. And if I have sinned in my bio, I do repent. And so with that new man, Christ's loving spirit in me, it is his right now, not mine.

I will tell you that I love you and will consider your words. I will attempt to believe the best about your intention. Don't misunderstand, I am not a super spiritual woman at the moment. I am trying to determine if I am a coward or truly seeking to follow the meekness of Christ.

Either way, meanness hurts. I will not push back and I won't send this email."

Jenn, you're a strong woman. You're a strong woman to not send that, and I'm proud of you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. You know what? So there's this really fine line between being a coward and being courageous sometimes. And I just don't know. Maybe it was self-controlled or maybe I was a scaredy cat, but obviously I didn't send the email. She's never received it. And I'm pretty confident she doesn't listen to this podcast, so she probably has no idea of my reply. So three years later I'm sharing this with you on The 4:13, not because I forgot about it -- you know, obviously, I haven't forgotten about it. I've kept it as a document in my computer thinking that someday I might use it. And clearly here we are. I haven't forgotten because some wounds have a really good memory.

Now, have I also ruminated on this for the last three days -- three years? Absolutely not. I saved it because I really thought, okay, maybe I'll use it. Some hurt can bring healing, and that's what this has done for me. Some hurt brings healing.

K.C. Wright: You know, there are also some grown-up mean guys. Meanness has no gender.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: So if the 4:13 question is can I to respond well to the grown-up mean girl or guy, the answer is yes. Yes, you can. So, Jenn, how can we? Should we all just write an email that we never send?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, right. Okay. So if a grown-up mean girl hurts you, here's what I've learned to do. Okay? I'm going to give you several things. The first one is this: pause. Pause. Don't react. Okay? You know, I started writing that email right away. Silence, though, is often the best response to unkindness. Sometimes it's a 10-second pause and sometimes it's a 10-year pause. Be silent long enough for God's voice to be louder than your emotions, and be silent long enough for his Word and his voice to be louder than the hurtful words of that grown-up mean girl.

K.C. Wright: James 1:19 tells us, "Be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to anger." If we are slow to speak, if we hold our tongues, then we have time to hear God. But also the grown-up meanie may have a chance to consider what she or he said. Letting the meanie sit with the silence may give some space for her words to echo back to her. Also, you don't give the instant satisfaction of a reply, so I'm given a big thumbs up to pausing.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, that's true.

K.C. Wright: I believe this is a very good way on handling things like this.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, I agree with you. It does, it protects us, it protects our testimony, and I do believe it just protects the potential healing that could occur in the relationship.

Okay, let me go to the second one. So you pause is the first. Number two, you be honest. Be honest. So be honest with yourself and with God. If it hurts, say so. You don't stuff it under the rug and you don't always blow it off. Okay? You have to acknowledge when something is hurtful or wrong. So sometimes that means you tell a trusted friend. But you have to be wise who you tell and how you tell, because sometimes -- I know for me, I run to certain friends because I know they're going to go, "Yeah, you're right; she's wrong," you know? Which is awfully gratifying. But what we really need is to be honest with a trusted friend. Someone who's not going to automatically throw somebody under the bus for us and with us, but somebody who's going to walk with us through the emotions and help us get to the place that we need to be in this situation. A friend may be able to be more objective, you know, because sometimes we're oversensitive. All right? And that's just the honest truth. Sometimes we're oversensitive. Or the grown-up meanie really could have been out of line, and a really trusted, mature friend can confirm that. And so another way you can be honest, besides just telling a friend that you trust, another way to be honest is to journal. That is where, K.C., you might draft a letter you won't send. Okay?

So I'll give you a third way. So first of all you're going to pause. Second, you're going to be honest. And the third way is tell God. And, you know, maybe if there were an order of importance, this would be the most important. But you got to pause first before you do anything. Okay? Tell God. Tell God. Express your feelings to him. He gets it. He understands. If anyone knows what it feels like to be unjustly accused, treated with unkindness, betrayed, mistreated, it's your Savior, Jesus. He is not unacquainted, Hebrews says, with what it feels like to suffer and to be human. He knows. He is acquainted with this. So tell him. He gets it. And then ask him for his perspective. Maybe you do need to change something, right? How are you going to know that if you don't tell God and listen for his response? Or maybe your attitude is just as wrong as her unkindness.

I know as I was writing that email, you could probably hear that transition in my heart. I started to realize, okay, my attitude is just as ugly right now as her unkindness. And so I need to know that from the Lord, because I'm not responsible for her choices and her behavior, I'm responsible for mine. So as you talk to God and as you listen, you know, you might hear that maybe that mean person is flat-out wrong and unkind. Maybe you're without fault. And God's wisdom and his grace will reveal that to you, and maybe you do need to confront that person's meanness. But when you tell God, the really cool thing is that you transfer your need to figure it out and defend yourself to him.

K.C. Wright: I love this verse. It's from Psalm 62. Thank God for the Word of God. Amen?

Jennifer Rothschild: Amen.

K.C. Wright: "O people, trust in him at all times." Not some of the time, not most of the time. All always means all. "O people, trust in him at all times. Pour out your heart." Sounds like a venting session from heaven. "Pour out your heart to him, for he is a refuge, a hiding place to us." That's Psalm 62:8. God wants you, listening right now, just to pour out your heart to him. You can trust him, so tell him what is hurting you, because, let's be honest, he's the only one that can fix it anyway.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

K.C. Wright: Telling a friend or anyone else, I mean, there is wisdom and counsel, we know that from Proverbs, but he's the one that can fix it. He's in the restoration, the healing business --

Jennifer Rothschild: That's right.

K.C. Wright: -- and he's the one that can actually hear and answer our prayers.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's right. So truly pausing and being honest are very important, but they will be incomplete if you don't tell God.

All right, let me give you the last one. Okay? Number four, (singing) let it go. K.C., are you going to sing?

K.C. Wright: (Singing) Let it go.

Jennifer Rothschild: I knew it. I knew this was coming.

K.C. Wright: (Singing) The cold never bothered me anyway. It always has. I hate winter. And I'm so glad Elsa --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: -- and Anna --

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

K.C. Wright: Well, they're coming out with a Frozen 2. Sorry. I have an eight-year-old. You're the one that brought this word up.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know, I did. I knew this would send you into a Disney journey right now. But, yes, Elsa had some wisdom.

K.C. Wright: Yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: Let it go.

K.C. Wright: That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: Let it go. Okay. Once you tell God, listen to God. Do you get that? Once you tell God, listen to God. If he directs you to confront her, then you do it, and then you let it go. If he doesn't, then you leave your hurt with him. Ask him for healing. And so one practical way to let it go is to write that letter that you will not send. Seriously. And once you write it, you reread it and you be satisfied that you poured out your heart. And then wad it up and throw it away. Let it go.

And I know it sounds simple. I really do get that, it sounds simple. But I also know that doesn't mean it's easy. But we complicate things when we get bitter and when we get vindictive or when we become the walking wounded. So don't let it control you. And right now, I'll be honest with you, I have been in the last many months in the middle of a conflict with someone, and it's been really difficult because this person has been unkind, and I'm having to practice this truth over and over. So when I say let it go, y'all, that may not be something you do one time. It may be something you do every morning. It may be something you do every hour. But let it go, because choosing to carry around a vindictive spirit or bitterness truly only hurts us. So let it go. And here's why. Because what you don't let go, you let grow.

K.C. Wright: Uh-oh.

Jennifer Rothschild: Mm-hmm.

K.C. Wright: Uh-oh.

Jennifer Rothschild: What you don't let go, you let grow. Ooh.

K.C. Wright: That is so true. We'll say it again for those of you in the back. What you don't let go, you let grow. Grown-up mean girls are not the boss of your emotions or your identity. Their behavior is most often more about them and their own brokenness than it is about you. So try to remember, as I do, that hurting people hurt people. But here's truth: healed people heal people. So let's be grownups who are whole and healed by the grace of Jesus.

Jennifer Rothschild: Ooh, yeah. And so when the mean girl strikes, then you strike back -- okay? -- with wisdom and humility and self-control and grace.

K.C. Wright: Don't you make me take off my heels. I'm sorry.

Jennifer Rothschild: Otherwise K.C.'s gonna --

K.C. Wright: I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Jennifer Rothschild: Otherwise K.C.'s gonna come. So please, please, for all of our sakes, you strike back with grace.

Okay, all of this is going to be on the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/46. Plus, after we say goodbye, I've got my three-minute stuff I love with the one I love, my husband, and I'm going to show you this gadget that I use to pour my coffee.

So remember that whatever you're going through, if it's a difficult situation with a mean person, you just remember that through Christ, you can do absolutely all things because he will give you the strength. I can.

K.C. Wright: I can.

Jennifer and K.C.: And you can.

K.C. Wright: You really can.

Jennifer Rothschild: Absolutely.

K.C. Wright: We believe in you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes.

Hey, it's stuff I love with the one I love. Phil's here with me.

Phil Rothschild: Hello everybody.

Jennifer Rothschild: And we're in the kitchen and I'm going to show you what is called a liquid detector. Okay, so what I'm holding in my hand, Phil, it's a little -- it's the size of a 9-volt battery, right?

Phil Rothschild: Yeah, size of a 9-volt battery, and there's probably one in there.

Jennifer Rothschild: There is a 9-volt battery in there. And it's covered with a little casing.

Phil Rothschild: A red casing, yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: And then it has these two little prongs.

Phil Rothschild: Actually, three.

Jennifer Rothschild: Three?

Phil Rothschild: There's actually three prongs there.

Jennifer Rothschild: Just little -- they're real sensitive. So my fingers are just a little wet, so when I touch it, it makes a little noise -- okay? -- because it's like a live wire.

Phil Rothschild: Yeah. So what do you use this for?

Jennifer Rothschild: So this is so that I know -- when I'm pouring liquid into a cup, like my coffee into a coffee cup, it will make a little beep to let me know when I'm at the top. And it's not very expensive. We'll have a link on the Show Notes. I've had some in the past that vibrate. This one beeps. And so when it gets up to the first -- to the very bottom of that prong, that middle prong, it'll be like a staggered beep, and that's your warning. And then when it gets to the very top, it will do one suspended long beep, and that's how I know to stop. Okay?

Phil Rothschild: And I don't know if you mentioned that it hangs over the side of the cup.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, no, I didn't. Thank you. Okay, so I'm hanging it over the side of the cup so that the outside -- the battery part is outside the cup and those little prongs are over the rim inside the cup.

Okay, so now I'm going to pour the liquid. And listen to when it gets close to the top. This takes, by the way, a lot of trust. (Pouring sound.) Coming. (Beeping sound.) See? That means it's almost there. Now, I'm going to do a little more (beeping sound) and I've hit the rim.

Phil Rothschild: So now, Jenn, your water is --

Jennifer Rothschild: It's right at the top.

Phil Rothschild: Right at the top. Maybe an eighth of an inch from the rim.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

Phil Rothschild: Maybe a quarter of an inch from the top of the rim.

Jennifer Rothschild: So what it does is it detects when the liquid is getting toward the top so you don't spill coffee all over yourself or all over the counter, because who wants to waste even a drop --

Phil Rothschild: That's right.

Jennifer Rothschild: -- of coffee?

So we'll have a link to this on the Show Notes. It's my little liquid detector. So thanks for hanging out with me and my honey. Bye.

Phil Rothschild: Bye-bye.

4:13 Podcast: Can I Find Comfort When My Heart Is Breaking? [Episode 301]

K.C. Wright: It's summer, and it's hot, so that means it's time for our hottest episodes on The 4:13. It's time for Summer Sizzle. For the next four weeks, we're featuring your most shared episodes, and they all happen to be great teachings from our girl, Jennifer Rothschild. This will be practical, wise, fun, and inspiring.

On today's episode, Episode 301, Jennifer answers the 4:13 question, Can I find comfort when my heart is breaking? Well, you know the answer. Yes, you can. So settle in for some fun stories, deep teaching straight from God's word. Here we go.

Jennifer Rothschild: On February 18th, 2018, my whole world changed. My Hero Dad closed his eyes to this world and opened them to heaven. Like C.S. Lewis wrote, "I did not know that grief would feel so much like fear, but I also didn't know how comfort would carry me." So today we're going to get really practical about how God comforts you when your heart is breaking. It'll be encouraging, real, and it'll give you some truth to tuck in your heart for when you need it the most. So cue the intro. It's time to get this thing going.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and biblical wisdom set you up to live the "I Can" life, because you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, your host, a woman who gets excited when the forecast calls for rain, because it means she can either wear her strawberry rain boots or stay in with a good book. Make her welcome, Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, I got me some cute rain boots, and they are covered in strawberries. In fact, I bet some of our listeners will recognize them because I got them in Plant City, Florida, from some ladies. You know, they have a big strawberry festival there. And we were there for a Fresh Grounded Faith conference. This was last year.

In fact, speaking of Fresh Grounded Faith, we are about to go to Buffalo, New York.

K.C. Wright: Ooh.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know, a little more chilly up there. But I'm excited, because when we're finished with the conference, we're going to go to Niagara Falls.

K.C. Wright: Wow.

Jennifer Rothschild: And I don't know if you've ever been, K.C.?

K.C. Wright: I haven't.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. Well, I've been once. And what I love about it is the intensity of the sound, of just that water pouring. It's beautiful. And I think that's why I like rainy days, by the way, it's the sound. I do like to wear my rain boots, but I love sitting inside with a good book on a rainy day.

What about you? Are rainy days good for you or not?

K.C. Wright: I do. I like -- (singing) Rainy days and Mondays --

Jennifer and K.C.: -- (singing) always get me down.

K.C. Wright: No, I do like a good rainy day, I really do. And, hey, you know what? Good things happen on rainy days, because just a couple of weeks ago -- check this out -- on 4/13 --

Jennifer Rothschild: On April 13th?

K.C. Wright: On April 13th --

Jennifer Rothschild: Uh-huh? A 4/13 day?

K.C. Wright: -- a 4/13 day, a friend of mine -- her dog had a puppy.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh.

K.C. Wright: But she didn't even know her dog was pregnant.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh.

K.C. Wright: And so out comes this one little puppy, and they have named him Philippians. They're huge 4:13ers, podcast listeners. They love our show. And so since this baby puppy was born on 4/13, they named him Philippians. So see, we've made a difference.

Jennifer Rothschild: I love that. So there's a little dog out there. I hope that Philippians behaves well, because that would really be a bad witness for the neighbors. "Philippians, don't poop in the yard." I love that. A 4:13 puppy, our very first. Hey, if you've got any cool 4:13 stories, we would love to hear them, so leave them in the comments.

And by the way, it is not raining here today, so I am not wearing my strawberry boots. But you know what's interesting about those boots, K.C., with what we're talking about today, is I got those right before my daddy actually passed away. Because I was in Plant City where -- it's very close to where my parents lived, and so -- okay. Anyway, let me get to the point here.

Because we're talking about handling heartbreak and how God comforts us. And so I started with that quote from C.S. Lewis where he said that he didn't know that grief felt so much like fear. I just think that's fascinating. I didn't know that until I experienced grief. But I also didn't realize that grief would feel so much like fatigue too. And I didn't know that it would, like, make me feel hollow, you know? My brain knew what death was, but my heart didn't really understand how it would feel like such a tearing and such an emptying.

C.S. Lewis, he also wrote that when you lose a beloved, someone who's beloved to you, it feels like an amputation. So I remember, even after a few months when I lost my daddy, I was just stupefied by this fog that I was walking through. It just felt like life was in slow motion. And you may know exactly what I'm talking about, what I'm describing, because you've felt it. You may have lost somebody that you deeply love. And notice I did not say loved, with a D. I say love. Because that emotion doesn't change just because they're not here anymore. You may have lost somebody dear to you, it could be a parent, it could be a spouse, it could be a child, and that's a heartbreak that's almost unbearable and unimaginable.

K.C. Wright: I love what Bob Goff says. He said that grief is love with no place to go. And I've experienced the loss of my father, the loss of my stepfather. Actually, last year -- oh my goodness, if I had to put on my funeral suit one more time. But we know this truth, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Jennifer Rothschild: Right. Right.

K.C. Wright: And I have this dread of losing those that I'm closest to. Like, I've got one grandma left, and I am connected to this woman's soul.

Jennifer Rothschild: I know you are.

K.C. Wright: And I'm here to tell you, when it's her time to move to heaven, y'all are going to be mopping me off the floor, even though I know the reality of heaven.

Jennifer Rothschild: Right. It doesn't make it hurt less.

K.C. Wright: Exactly.

Jennifer Rothschild: Well, and no matter what your loss or heartbreak is, it matters because you matter, and God's comfort is for you. For a long time, K.C., I knew this truth -- right? -- about God's comfort in grief, but I really understand it differently now. Because just like you said, if there was anything I feared or dreaded, it was losing my dad, because he was my hero. He grounded me and protected me. He made my world make sense. And so the thought of losing him just made me feel like Planet Earth would never ever be safe or okay again.

Now, let me just pause, though, and say, I was married 30 years when my daddy died, and we didn't even live in the same town as my daddy. So even though my husband really is a stud, you know, and he's protective and loving and all that good stuff, there's just something about a girl and her dad, you know, when she's got a good relationship with her dad. There's just something very foundational on the cellular level about that.

So I just thought that I would not be able to get up under the weight of the grief of losing him. I was afraid that I'd never feel comfort that was greater than my sorrow. I thought that his absence in my life would be a hole that I would fall into and never find a way out of. Yet, I realize now that if I had even had a glimpse of the kind of comfort that God would give me, I would have had no fear.

And so here's what I want you to know today. God's comfort does not erase my grief. It does not. God's comfort does not erase my grief. But it absorbs it. His comfort doesn't make my sorrow less, but it makes my capacity to face it greater. And the same is true for you. God's comfort helps us walk through grief and sorrow.

K.C. Wright: We all experience loss in this life. In fact, what we're talking about may be old news to you because you've been through some of this deep sorrow and grief yourself. Here's what the Bible says to us. "Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted." That's in Matthew 5:4. Now, the blessing isn't in the grief of mourning, it's in the comfort you feel from God, even when the grief is so intense. Grief can be consuming.

But here's another Scripture from Jeremiah I want you to listen to. "Yet this I call to mind and therefore I have hope: Because of the Lord's great love we are not consumed, for his compassions never fail. They are new every morning; great is your faithfulness." Lamentations 3:21 and 23. They're new every morning because we used up all of yesterday's.

Jennifer Rothschild: Isn't that the truth? God is the one who really does comfort us. Absolutely all comfort we experience ultimately originates from him. I mean, that's what 2 Corinthians 1 tells us. It calls God the Father of compassion and the God of all comfort. It says that he's the one who comforts us in all of our troubles. And there's a reason he does that, so that we can comfort those who are in any trouble through the comfort that we ourselves have received from God.

And so in the Book of Isaiah, too, God says the same thing. He says, "I, even I, am he who comforts you." That's Isaiah 51:12.

K.C. Wright: There is no greater comfort than to know that God himself is with you right now. And notice that verse Jenn just quoted in 2 Corinthians. Paul says God comforts us in all our troubles. I always love the word "all."

Jennifer Rothschild: All.

K.C. Wright: All means all. It doesn't matter what you're going through, God is with you to comfort you.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. So the question is then, how? Right? How in a very practical sense? Because we know this is true. So just in case you need a reminder of how he comforts us when our hearts are breaking, or maybe you're in a place where your heart is breaking and you know God is the God of all comfort but you're having trouble grasping it, let me show you two very practical ways that God comforts us that you can or maybe even are experiencing and just haven't really connected the dots yet.

So the first way that God comforts us is through his Word. His Word literally comforts us. The promises in Scripture, the counsel of Scripture, and the unchanging truth of Scripture is what God uses to continue to bring me comfort, not just over the loss of my dad, but in every area of life. So, K.C., I want you to read us some of these verses from Psalm 119, because these are just some of the truths that I hold closely.

K.C. Wright: "This is my comfort in my affliction: that your promise gives me life." Psalms 119:50. "Let your steadfast love comfort me according to your promise to your servant." Psalms 119:76. "My soul melts away for sorrow. Strengthen me according to Your Word." Psalms 119:28.

Jennifer Rothschild: Those are so vivid, aren't they? Because that is how we feel, melts away. But did you hear how it's God's Word that brings life and comfort and strength?

You know, it reminds me of another verse I want you to hear in Psalm 119. It says, "If your law had not been my delight, I would have perished in my affliction." That's Psalm 119:92. And we'll have all these on the Show Notes, by the way.

But the point is, you're just not going to make it without His Word. You just won't. I can't. None of us can. The promise that comes from God's Living Word will bring you life because it's alive. And so it'll provide you with the hope that life really is good and it will be good again. His Word echoes his love to you, even in your lowest and darkest season. And this love, it will lift you and it will assure you and remind you that God is with you. So if you're grieving, if you're experiencing some loss or your heart is breaking, then open His Word and open your heart, and his love and his strength will rush in and they will be the comfort that you need.

K.C. Wright: And we've got some comforting "With You" Scriptures you can download for free at 413podcast.com/35. So when we're done, go get it so you will have it for you or a friend.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. It's a good thing to just tuck in your purse or in your Bible or in your heart to be able to share with somebody when they're needing some comfort.

And, in fact, that brings me to the second way that God comforts us, is through each other, his people. God's people comfort us. You've heard that old phrase "there's strength in numbers"? I used to think that that meant where there's lots of people with you -- right? -- you become this mighty force -- right? -- all of you together. You don't personally get stronger yourself, but the two of you together or the three of you together become this strong presence together. But I think of that phrase totally differently now, and here's why.

So it was one morning between the time that my Daddy passed away and the memorial service. I remember I was sitting in his recliner, and I was just empty. I was spent, I was sad, I was fatigued, and I had nothing left. I was just hollow and worn out with grief. And it was then that I hear the front door open, and it's my brother with his family. And they walk through the front door, and something inside me kind of stirred a little bit. And then a few minutes later, my other brother and his wife show up, and again something rose up inside me. And I just felt stronger because they were there. Something inside me that had been weak began to feel a little stronger and a little more fortified.

And here's the thing. They didn't bring pompoms or pep talks. I mean, they were as broken and as sad as I was, but they were just present. And when they showed up, so did some strength and some comfort. And that can be true for you too, because there is strength in numbers. Because when others join you in your grief, you literally become stronger. You have a strength to face your sorrow because you're not facing it alone. You have strength to carry your burden because you're not carrying it all by yourself.

Here's what we need to remember, though. God's people, they don't bring comfort with the words they say about grief. You don't have to give fancy words about grief. That's not how we comfort each other. Our comfort toward each other comes from the very presence that we bring in each other's grief. So you don't need to feel like -- sometimes we're shy about entering into other people's grief because we say, "I don't know what to say." And, y'all, I don't know what to say. But the point is, you don't have to say anything. Just being present in someone's grief, just being with them in silence, just washing their dishes while they sit on the couch. Anything that you do being present will give them strength and comfort.

And it's really interesting, the word "comfort" comes from two Latin words that mean "with" and "strong." In other words, you and I are made strong by being with each other. That's what true comfort is. God uses his people to take all those weak and broken pieces of our sorrow and help make them come back together and build us into this fortress of strength.

K.C. Wright: Yeah. And listen to this that Paul wrote in 2 Corinthians 7:5-6. "For when we came into Macedonia, we had no rest, but we were harassed at every turn -- conflicts on the outside, fears within. But God, who comforts the downcast, comforted us by the coming of Titus." God was the one who comforted, and he did it through his man Titus. Okay? He uses people as his comforting presence. He is the head; we are his body. We are his arms, we are his feet. We weren't designed to do this life alone. We truly need each other. So that means when you receive the comfort from God, you have something to give to others. And remember the verse in 2 Corinthians 1? We can comfort those in any trouble with the comfort we ourselves have received from God. So if you've received it, give it. If you need it, receive it from God himself, His Word and his people.

So go to the Show Notes at 413podcast.com/35 to get a summary of what you've heard today. Plus download for free the "With You" Scriptures to bring you comfort. You may need them or you may need to print them so you can share them with someone whose heart is breaking right now.

Jennifer Rothschild: Remember, we're here for you. We are here for you, no matter what you're facing, no matter what you're feeling, no matter what your loss. And you've got people in your life who can be comfort to you also, but the most important thing you have is God's Word. He is with you, my friend. So remember, you can do all things through Christ who gives you strength. I can.

K.C. Wright: I can.

Jennifer and K.C.: And you can.